Guitar Build

[JustStartin]

I just started building a guitar. I thought I'd show you my progress. :)

http://img104.exs.cx/img104/7305/100006000014uq.th.jpg (http://img104.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img104&image=100006000014uq.jpg)http://img104.exs.cx/img104/5998/100006200013qh.th.jpg (http://img104.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img104&image=100006200013qh.jpg)http://img104.exs.cx/img104/868/100006800014uy.th.jpg (http://img104.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img104&image=100006800014uy.jpg)http://img104.exs.cx/img104/1143/100007100019kz.th.jpg (http://img104.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img104&image=100007100019kz.jpg)

1) Planed mahogany for the body
2) Traced Tele body on 5/8 particle board
3) Glued up 2 piece body
4) Cut out template
Note: If you make a conventional body shape buy a template. Making them is a pain. I screwed up once making it, and shaping it to final size is a nightmare.


http://img32.exs.cx/img32/7164/10000648rf.th.jpg (http://img32.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img32&image=10000648rf.jpg)http://img32.exs.cx/img32/8813/10000751yy.th.jpg (http://img32.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img32&image=10000751yy.jpg)

6) Run the quilt through the joiner.
7) Glue it up

I needed more clamps :eek: , but I wasnt about to go out and buy more. I clamped the template to the body, used screws outside the template, barbell plates, and other improvising to do it. Should be alright. :hmmm:

If you click those thumbnails, you should get a full size image. :D

[neeb]

crazyy, keep it up

[GuitarDude636]

nice man, is this your first one building?

[JustStartin]

nice man, is this your first one building?

Yup. Just hope I dont screw it up. Taking up guitar at my age, I've come to the conclusion, I may be better at building them than I will be at playing them. Some other guys are building also. I hope they post their stuff.

I hope by posting mine, I can help other guys who go at it themselves. I'm going to post the whole process. Screw ups(hopefully none) and all.

Suggestions appreciated. :)

[dkitt]

How are you going to use the template? I just made a template out of bristol board (cutting it out with a drywall knife), and then I'm just going to trace around it with a pencil and cut the body shape out with a scroll saw. I'm going to use an ABM bridge and problably Golden Age pups. I prefer P-90s but I want to try a PRS type splitting arrangement. :hmmm:

[zappatude]

Juststartin thanks for the pics. Great project. It will be fun to watch your progress.
dkitt will you be posting pics also?
What will you guys do for necks, and frets?

[JustStartin]

How are you going to use the template? I just made a template out of bristol board (cutting it out with a drywall knife), and then I'm just going to trace around it with a pencil and cut the body shape out with a scroll saw. I'm going to use an ABM bridge and problably Golden Age pups. I prefer P-90s but I want to try a PRS type splitting arrangement. :hmmm:

I'm going to cut the body out with a router, and a top bearing pattern bit. The template has to have square edges so I get a clean cut with the router. I'll cut it out with multiple passes, hence I need a thick template (5/8" particle board). There is no way I get it with one pass, even with a Makita industrial router. Its hard to explain, but hopefully I'll be doing it tommorrow. I"ll post pics of the whole deal. Its simple, the pics will make it clear.

Getting the square edge on the template is what made it such a PITA. I had to set the rough cut template on a block, and rig up a square edge sander. Getting inside the cutaway was a nightmare. Never again.

Your way will work too. I dont have a scroll saw or a bandsaw. The router should give me a nice finished edge, with minimal sanding to do once I get the body cut out.

[dkitt]

dkitt will you be posting pics also?
What will you guys do for necks, and frets?

The only things I ordered so far are the maple LP neck from Mightmite and the body wood from a company in Burlington Ont. Who knows what the neck is going to be like when I get it - I just liked the nut width, the flat radius, the fret size, the headstock shape, etc.

I already have the ultimate Tele...:rolleye:

[JustStartin]

Juststartin thanks for the pics. Great project. It will be fun to watch your progress.
dkitt will you be posting pics also?
What will you guys do for necks, and frets?

I'm going to buy a neck also. I'm not getting into necks the first go round. After this project, I'll piddle with making some jigs for cutting out necks.

[FrEtboaRDonFIRE]

Wow, JustStartin, verrrry interesting! I like the way it looks so far...flametop telecaster...what kind of pickups you going to put in that baby? Remember to keep us posted!

Build on,

-=FoF=-

[socialmisfit]

very very cool indeed. i tried making a guitar in woodshop at school, in the shape of a gibson explorer. i was kind of limited to crap wood, so i just cut it out and it broke! anyway, really sweet project! hope to see it when its finished!

[Slipstream]

Hey Just, pretty cool man! Lookin' forward to seein' the progress as ya go.

Here's some of the wood I have so far (still lookin' for a good piece of body wood, still thinkin' redwood - basswood is a possibility).


Bloodwood (patch of satin verathane to see how it looks, and small notch cut with a knife. Needs planing) - Panel (poplar), a piece of poplar stained red-mahogany (not red at all, more of a black), and a piece of mahogany.

http://www.alvarious.com/graphics/blood.jpg http://www.alvarious.com/graphics/woods.jpg

[JustStartin]

Slipstream, thats a pretty sweet piece of bloodwood. I know they aint givin that stuff away. What are the dimensions on that? Looks like a full 2" x 8" from your pics.
If so, you may want to make a body out of that, if you dont mind the weight, or bookmatch it for a top.

[Slipstream]

It's 4/4" x 5" x 5'. It would make a beautiful body, but man, that stuff's heavy. One thought I had was cutting some slices and doing a vaneer kinda thing over a lighter wood (bookmatch). Then I thought a contrasting color would be nice. Maybe a red-dye tint in a clear finish, with a dark binding around the edges of the body (1/4" bloodwood with a 1/8" radius round-over) and a light colored binding on the neck and headstock (1/4" strip of the same wood as the body).

I'm also kickin' around ideas for a headstock shape. I've been collecting pics of custom guitars so I can be different, yet cool.

[zappatude]

You guys are awesome

[JustStartin]

Cut out the body this morning. Left the top undone, I want the square edge at the top. It will make it easier to install the neck properly. You can click the thumbnails for larger images.

http://img120.exs.cx/img120/940/10000785cr.th.jpg (http://img120.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img120&image=10000785cr.jpg)http://img120.exs.cx/img120/3215/10000797su.th.jpg (http://img120.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img120&image=10000797su.jpg)http://img120.exs.cx/img120/7264/10000811mj.th.jpg (http://img120.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img120&image=10000811mj.jpg)http://img120.exs.cx/img120/9272/10000846ih.th.jpg (http://img120.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img120&image=10000846ih.jpg)

http://img109.exs.cx/img109/9646/10000976sx.th.jpg (http://img109.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img109&image=10000976sx.jpg)http://img75.exs.cx/img75/7500/100009100016no.th.jpg (http://img75.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img75&image=100009100016no.jpg)http://img75.exs.cx/img75/2100/10000939lc.th.jpg (http://img75.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img75&image=10000939lc.jpg)


Pic 1) That just shows how a top bearing pattern bit works with a template.

Pic 2) Just shows the progress using the template.

Pic 3) Took the template off, the cut was deep enough now for the bearing to ride on the cut section of the body.

Note: What the pic doesnt show is after I removed the template, I masked the perimeters of the quilt with painters tape. A light adhesive tape. I did that so the router base wouldnt mar the quilt.

Pic 4) What the body edge looked like after the router cut

Note: Mahogany is tough stuff. I had alot of chatter marks and some grain tear out. A few divots when I jerked with the router. That big Makita can be a bear if it gets into grain it doesnt like. If you click the thumbnail for the full size you can see what I'm talking about.
No major problem, it all sanded out nice with 80 grit paper. I used 2 routers, both the small and big Makita. Mostly the big one when I got into the Mahogany.

Pic 5) The edge after sanding

Pic 6 and 7) The front and back.

What I'm really happy about is the laminated top. It came out superb. No voids at the mating lines of the quilt or where the maple meets the mahogany on the sides. Fargin dead on balls perfect. :toohappy:
I was going to paint the sides and back, but now I'm definetely going to do it transparent.

I'll post later on how I mated the quilt. Worked great and gave me sweet joint.

[Slipstream]

Comin' right along! On the edges, did you use a drum sander for the 80 grit?

I feel the same way about the paint. Mahogany should be visible. Actually, any wood worth using should be. I love being able to see the grain.

[fatsoPanda]

awesome, i can't wait to see the finish product!!

[JustStartin]

Comin' right along! On the edges, did you use a drum sander for the 80 grit?

I feel the same way about the paint. Mahogany should be visible. Actually, any wood worth using should be. I love being able to see the grain.

No drum sander. I could never get a smooth edge with that. I used a block sander. Actually an auto body tool. You can see it in the fifth pic above the side shot of the guitar. Its hard but flexible rubber. Flat on one side, curved on the other. Just flip the paper to either side depending on whats appropriate. I highly recommend one. You can get them at any Auto Supply Store. Couldnt tell you the cost, had this one for years, but imagine there still inexpensive.

I'm with you on the wood issue. I was concerned how the lamination would come out since I short on clamps, but seeing how it turned out, no way I paint it.

[zappatude]

Awesome. Man I'm so glad your not gunna paint over those beautiful pieces of wood. Again I say thanks for taking the time to share this with us.

[Slipstream]

No drum sander. I could never get a smooth edge with that. I used a block sander. Actually an auto body tool. You can see it in the fifth pic above the side shot of the guitar. Its hard but flexible rubber. Flat on one side, curved on the other. Just flip the paper to either side depending on whats appropriate. I highly recommend one. You can get them at any Auto Supply Store. Couldnt tell you the cost, had this one for years, but imagine there still inexpensive.

I'm with you on the wood issue. I was concerned how the lamination would come out since I short on clamps, but seeing how it turned out, no way I paint it.Yeah, I've got one of those kinda sanding blocks.

I take it ya had to route part way around, then move the clamps to finish going the rest of the way around?

[JustStartin]

Yeah, I've got one of those kinda sanding blocks.

I take it ya had to route part way around, then move the clamps to finish going the rest of the way around?

Exactly. Its kind of a pain. I had the blank set on a block of wood so the blank wasnt resting on the bottom of the clamps. Thats why the weights are on the side I wasnt working on, to balance it out so the blank wouldnt tip when I set the router on the end. Not the best way to do it, and I dont recommend it. But after two mugs of coffee, I wanted to start immediately. I was in the Beavis, Cornholio mode after a couple of cappacinos'.

Once the bearing on the bit starts to ride on the body cut out, you can toss the template, clamps, and block.

[Slipstream]

It took me a minute to figger out what the weights were. For mine I'm thinkin' of making a patern out of hardboard (heavy cardboard stuff), then trace around the shape and cut it out with a bandsaw, then smooth with a drum sander. I have one of my routers set up with one in it so I can put it on a router table and just work it around. Finishing up with that rubber sanding block.

It was a really nice day today, so I went to set up my sawhorses outside, and I noticed that I needed to replace some of the legs. I made 'em out of 2x4s for the tops and 1x3s for the legs. I put a sheet of plywood on top to make a work bench. Anyway, I went to Home Depot (and one other place) to get another 1x3 and look around for a 2"x12" piece of redwood for the body. I got the 1x3 but no redwood.

Last time I was at Home Depot there was hardly anyone there. The snow is all melted now though, and it seemed like people were coming out of the wood work (sorry for the pun, just hadda throw that in). :)

[JustStartin]

It took me a minute to figger out what the weights were. For mine I'm thinkin' of making a patern out of hardboard (heavy cardboard stuff), then trace around the shape and cut it out with a bandsaw, then smooth with a drum sander. I have one of my routers set up with one in it so I can put it on a router table and just work it around. Finishing up with that rubber sanding block.

It was a really nice day today, so I went to set up my sawhorses outside, and I noticed that I needed to replace some of the legs. I made 'em out of 2x4s for the tops and 1x3s for the legs. I put a sheet of plywood on top to make a work bench. Anyway, I went to Home Depot (and one other place) to get another 1x3 and look around for a 2"x12" piece of redwood for the body. I got the 1x3 but no redwood.

Last time I was at Home Depot there was hardly anyone there. The snow is all melted now though, and it seemed like people were coming out of the wood work (sorry for the pun, just hadda throw that in). :)

Using a band saw to rough out the body is the way to go. I dont have one, and when I tried to roughcut the body with a jigsaw it was a joke...not happening, so I did the whole deal with the router. To much material to remove with a drum sander.

One thing you need to get is a Robo-Sander. Its a drum sander with a bottom bearing. After rough cutting your body with the bandsaw. You attach the template to the body. You could screw the template to the body where the pickup routes are going to be. Stick the robo in your drill press and your ready to go. A robo would give you a perfect edge, no having to eye the thing up.
It also has a solid core it doesnt give, will follow the template to a T. Heres a pic of mine. Its 2" in height, so can handle a fender or paul.
http://img110.exs.cx/img110/1001/10001025ah.th.jpg (http://img110.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img110&image=10001025ah.jpg)

I got it at a trade show about a year or two ago. I think it ran about $18. If I had a bandsaw I would of used it. Check Ebay, it wouldnt surprise me if they had them.

You definetely have an easier way to do it, with the band saw. I say score a Robo Sander.

[Slipstream]

That Robo sander sounds like a good idea. I don't have a bandsaw, but I think I know where I can use one. I have a jigsaw, but I guess 2" is a bit much for it.

[Slipstream]

Here's a preliminary sketch of my headstock design:

http://www.alvarious.com/graphics/head.jpg

[JustStartin]

WOW! :eek:
How are you going to do that. Paint, some carving maybe. I like the hawk perched on the tuning pegs. Your neck is going to be insane. Bloodwood, the works.
I'd go with redwood on your body over bass with a neck like your planning. I'm thinking appearance, not with any tone goals you may have. Your going the whole luthier route with this axe, neck building and all.
The neck is the hardest thing to build considering the tolerances involved. Cant wait to see it.

[Slipstream]

Thanks. I plan to engrave it with a Dremmal. I'll cut out the eagle head profile though. I didn't have a pencil so I drew that with a chunk of charcoal. I'll draw it a couple more times before I go carvin' it. It'll have to be dimensionally correct (longer, hole spacing, etc.).

Wait'l I get to the neck-setting part. I have a really cool idea for that. Not a regular set, and not a neck-through, but a deep-set. The end of the bloodwood will terminate about halfway between the bridge and the end of the body (by the back strap button). That way I will have one continuous piece of dense solid wood from tuning machines to the bridge, and then some. I'm looking for max sustain.

Plus I'm looking to make the body all one piece. Most neck-throughs have two piece bodies. One glued to the top, one glued to the bottom. Also, most sets are like mortice and tenon - rectangular tenon into rectangular mortice. I like the idea of cutting a groove in the mortice with a tongue on the neck. A slide-in tongue and groove kinda thing.

Throw in a Pearly Gates humbucker and a Sustainiac and I'll be able to hold a note all the way through a song!



Afterthought: Paint? On bloodwood? Go wash yer mouth out with soap! :)

[SG_74]

Slip and Just: I'm curious, how do you make the slots for the neck and pups to sit in?

I have been toying with the idea of making a real crazy metal guitar body for a while now but I don't know where to get the wood, or how to cut the holes to route the pups and neck.

[SG_74]

Nevermind, I looked it up and you need a router. Kewl, I shall see if my school has one :p

All I need now is some decent wood.

[SG_74]

Oh btw I found this great website on building guitar related things cheaply click here... (http://galileo.spaceports.com/~fishbake/)

[Slipstream]

SG 74, I'm exploring that link. Mostly electronic stuff (I'll be buying mine off the shelf), but the body shaping idea he has is much like what I had in mind.

For body wood ya might consider Luthiers Mercantile - mostly wood (http://www.lmii.com/CartTwo/Secondproducthead.asp?CategoryName=+Solid+Body+Woo ds) .

[SG_74]

Thanks Slip, I'll explore it when I get home :D

[Puddlegum66]

That is a flat out AWESOME looking headstock. When you're done and it sounds great, have you thought about making guitars for other people? My roomate just finished a neck-through tele style. He bought a carvin neck for it, but did the body himself. Sounds great. It's the 3rd one he's done so far. Could be rewarding both personally and finacially to start your own business.

[Slipstream]

Thanks, but no thanks. I'm retired. I like doin' whatever I feel like doin'. This is a one-of-a-kind project. Next time I make something it might be a piece of furniture or a maybe a cigar box. Go to a smoke shop and look at the wooden cigar boxes. Some of 'em are awesome. Or maybe a sword (steel, not wood :) ). I've been wanting to make one of those for some time now. One o' them King Arthur types.

[GuitarDude636]

Is it difficult to build a guitar? (not including neck and headstock)

[Slipstream]

Is it difficult to build a guitar? (not including neck and headstock)Yeah.

[JustStartin]

Man, I gotta score a neck. I got nothin to do this weekend except yard work. :(
Slipstream, dkitt, start cutting some wood. I need a fix to get me through the weekend.

[dkitt]

Man, I gotta score a neck. I got nothin to do this weekend except yard work. :(
Slipstream, dkitt, start cutting some wood. I need a fix to get me through the weekend.

The neck for my project is still in transit, and I'm still mucking around with templates, trying to improve on the classic LP shape. I'm trying to make the upper bout and waist wider, so that it sits on the knee better - without wrecking the classic good looks.

Slip, I like your idea about using sanding drums with a router table. I should try that... :hmmm:

[Slipstream]

I plan to get started on my neck in the next day or two. Yardwork is done (I raked some leaves and that's it. Looks fine from here :) ). I put my sawhorses together. I'll put a board on 'em and set up my table saw, make some cuts on the bloodwood, and glue up a piece on the end - to make the headstock thicker so I can cut the angle. Hard to describe, but I'll post pics.

I'm still pondering the body. I want to go with a shape similar to an acoustic. I'll have it figgered out by the time I start cutting it out, I hope. :D

[JustStartin]

Ok, I'm done with the practice session. I still suck, but thats another thread.

One thing bad about down time is, you think to much. I look at my axe body, and I say its to pretty with the quilt top. Its not me. I've fallen victim to the what a guitar should be according to the big cookie cutter marketers. I've failed, a sucker, another drone on a leash.

My guitar can still be saved. Here is the solution. I was checking out inlay outfits. I found the inlay that can make a statement. The description of this inlay is:

"For The Job That Requires Poor Taste"
http://www.luthiersupply.com/image_update/madolininlay/Mud_Flap_Gals-WMOP-FULL.jpg

PERFECT!

I can get the truck flap naked lady in pearl, gold pearl, or abalone. A fitting headstock ornament. I'll be putting her behind the strings, not in a clear sight line. I figure behind the strings on the head stock will give that "babe behind bars vibe".

I feel better now.

[Slipstream]

Cool man! I like it. So you're into that woman prison thing too, huh? (jk) :)

I'd go with the abalone, but that's subjective.

[JustStartin]

Cool man! I like it. So you're into that woman prison thing too, huh? (jk) :)

I'd go with the abalone, but that's subjective.

Yeah I'll admit to being a fan of the "Babes behind Bars Film Genre". There was this one starring Brigette Neilson..........oops, we'll have to find a newsgroup on the usenet for that one. To oft overlooked for the artistic content of these masterpieces. Fellini was a peasant, when compared to likes of Roger Korman if you ask me.

I dig the abalone myself. I'll go with what matches the fret markers. :D

[Slipstream]

Artistic content, yeah, that's it. One must indulge the arts. I mostly read the articles though. :)

Anyway, if the fret markers are dots you could always make abalone blocks to put in. I'm gonna make blocks, but with a secret material (to be divulged if it works out).

[JustStartin]

I'm staying out of the neck for this trip. My experience with a dremel type tool was porting cylinder heads. I could put a glass smooth hole through a neck for optimum air flow, but it wouldnt do squat for tone. As far as the inlays on the neck, I'll take what I get.
As your skills improve, I'll commission you to make me the bowling pin and martini glass fret inlays I have in mind for my "Regular Guy" guitar line. :D

Secret material eh! My version of secret material, was going through the old ladies nail polish selection. Lot of colors and pearls available, and sandable too! :p

[Slipstream]

Nail polish is some good stuff. My Grandfather ran over my .22 rifle when I was a kid and broke the stock in half. He just put some wood glue on the mating surfaces, wrapped the stock with 1/8" cord (it was just in the handle part), then coated it with clear fingernail polish. That was over 30 years ago, and it's still holdin'. One of my sister's boys has it now.

[JustStartin]

Nail polish is some good stuff. My Grandfather ran over my .22 rifle when I was a kid and broke the stock in half. He just put some wood glue on the mating surfaces, wrapped the stock with 1/8" cord (it was just in the handle part), then coated it with clear fingernail polish. That was over 30 years ago, and it's still holdin'. One of my sister's boys has it now.

Yes, nail polish. Did you divulge this awhile back? I saw it somewhere, I think it was here. Its a great idea. Wonder if there is a site that does analysis on the structural integrity of Mary Kay and Revlon products. They're missing out on the luthier market. More marketing is needed on their part. It would cause a price dump in shell pricing. :p

[Slipstream]

I rate them as "strong buy", that is 'til word gets out. :)

[Slipstream]

Didn't get much done today. Worn out from a long hard week. I went to Home Depot again to look for something to use for the body. I finally decided to make hollow body. Cedar for the frame and bracing, then a panel for a skin. It has nice straight even-colored grain. I'll see what I get done tomorrow.

[JustStartin]

Western Red Cedar? I have it coming out of my ears. I use it for any post and beam stuff I do. Mostly 4x6 timber, but I have alot of 1X10 clear stock, I use for trim work. You should of called.
I stayed away from it, due to its rep as not good for solid body electrics. The price on WRC goes up every time I buy it. I have alot of cypress also.

[Slipstream]

I don't think it's western red. Not sure though, I'll check it out tomorrow. NC is a little far, shipping would be more than what I paid for the wood. Besides, I wanted it like right now. Can't get redwood anywhere here in Southern Oregon. I might pick some up in CA when I go there next week. I'll do some readin' up on tone woods again. See if I can get info on the Cedar.

[dkitt]

I don't think it's western red. Not sure though, I'll check it out tomorrow. NC is a little far, shipping would be more than what I paid for the wood. Besides, I wanted it like right now. Can't get redwood anywhere here in Southern Oregon. I might pick some up in CA when I go there next week. I'll do some readin' up on tone woods again. See if I can get info on the Cedar.


Slip, Here's what Luthier Michael Spalt says about Cedar:

"i use some unconventional tonewoods and I've built solid guitars from cedar and redwood. I found I really loved the tone; its very transparent and harmonic with a lot of airiness and overtones. At the same time, it responds quickly so you get a lot of bite."

He also makes a lot of hollow bodies with a central block of maple for strength.
http://www.spaltinstruments.com

[Slipstream]

Slip, Here's what Luthier Michael Spalt says about Cedar:

"i use some unconventional tonewoods and I've built solid guitars from cedar and redwood. I found I really loved the tone; its very transparent and harmonic with a lot of airiness and overtones. At the same time, it responds quickly so you get a lot of bite."

He also makes a lot of hollow bodies with a central block of maple for strength.
http://www.spaltinstruments.comThanks dkitt, that's reassuring. I'm having coffee right now, trying to get my head together, but I'll def. do some more reading on it. I checked out that site. The Ruby looks interesting, but a little gaudy. I like the shape of the body. Kind of a cross between a LP and a banjo, and a bigsby lookin' tailpiece. I don't like the six in-line tuners though. I prefer the 3x3.

[JustStartin]

This is good to hear concerning Western Red Cedar. I imagine Spalt is talking Western Red since it is the most sought after variety of Cedar.

I know it is used quite often in acoustics. One thing about it is, it is as soft as wood can get. Colors range from a deep brown, burgundy, pinkish, lightbrown to almost white sap woods. Its the easiest stuff you'll find to work with. Very user friendly, stable and straight.

Slipstream, if you have problems getting what you need. Let me know. Its yours, just pay the shipping. The widest stuff I have at the moment is 5 1/2". I may have some 7 1/2". I know I have plenty of 2x6 rough cut clear sections , that you could make a 3 piece body blank out of.

I give my cut offs away. One guy uses them to carve duck decoys, another builds birdhouses and cigar boxes with it.

[dkitt]

Just, What kind of Cypress do you have? Is it American or the European variety used by Flamenco luthiers?
Thats the first wood I went looking for, but couldn't find. The luthier's type has a very high strength to weight ratio.

[JustStartin]

The cypress I have came out of the Georgia swamps. The stuff is old growth. Tight growth rings and brick hard. Took forever to dry and checked horribly while curing. I have some pieces I cut and planed for a guitar, but decided to go with conventional guitar tonewoods with the maple and mahogany. When I get back to the axe, I'll take some pictures of it so you can get a look at it. You're welcome to it, if you want some.

I did find a luthier in Florida who considers cypress a magnificent tonewood. Here is the link to the article.
http://www.resurrectionguitars.com/articles.html
About 1/2 way through the article he brings up cypress.

If this guitar thing turns into an addiction, I'll definetely use it for a body at some point.

[dkitt]

I'll take some pictures of it so you can get a look at it. You're welcome to it, if you want some.



That would be great to see some pictures. I need three pieces 18" long by 4.5" wide by 1.75" thick, straight with no knots. I'd be happy to pay you for good medium-density peices with an even attractive grain.

I have some wood set to go already but I haven't cut it up yet - still trying to perfect the template.

[JustStartin]

That would be great to see some pictures. I need three pieces 18" long by 4.5" wide by 1.75" thick, straight with no knots. I'd be happy to pay you for good medium-density peices with an even attractive grain.

I have some wood set to go already but I haven't cut it up yet - still trying to perfect the template.

Will do with the pics. The stuff I have done is an 1 1/2". I milled to that way back when I was using it. I was going to top it something. I may have some rough 2X around, I'll look and see what I have.

Templates are a pain. I was lucky that the tech at the local music store let me trace a tele. Use a drum sander to form it. Its a tool I too often neglect to use.

[Slipstream]

I went to get started cutting on some wood, and discovered the handle is missing on my rip fence. The weekend ain't no time to be goin' to the store, so I'll continue on Monday. Got some guitar playin' to do anyhow. Here's a couple pics of my work bench.
http://www.alvarious.com/graphics/work-1.jpg http://www.alvarious.com/graphics/work-2.jpg

Oh yeah, and the tag on the end of the cedar says, "western grn cedar". I gave it the ol' tap test for tone, and it's got a nice ring to it.

[JustStartin]

That would be great to see some pictures. I need three pieces 18" long by 4.5" wide by 1.75" thick, straight with no knots. I'd be happy to pay you for good medium-density peices with an even attractive grain.

I have some wood set to go already but I haven't cut it up yet - still trying to perfect the template.

dkitt, here is a pic of the cypress. This stuff is 1 1/2" thick, 5 1/2" wide. A bit thin for your needs, but its a good representation of what I got. I may have some that hasnt been milled yet, I'll check, but it will take some digging. Click the pic for a bigger image.

http://img48.exs.cx/img48/9145/10001156wv.th.jpg (http://img48.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img48&image=10001156wv.jpg)

Slipstream, I dont think I've ever seen one of those portable table saws that didnt have the fence handle broken. 9 out 10 of the those in operation have C clamps holding the fence true. Me thinks that yours has been bouncing around the back of your truck. You have western red, but if the wood is designated green, it means wet or uncured. WRC cures fast. Let set for awhile before you get into it. Here is a model of the work I do with cedars. Its a small display of room addition packages I make for dealers. This is at a show going on right now locally.

http://img17.exs.cx/img17/2109/10001102wu.th.jpg (http://img17.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img17&image=10001102wu.jpg)

Here some added eye candy for the timber junkies. I went to the Klingspor shop today to pick up a drum sanding kit. Here is some of the dope they sell in the back room.

http://img17.exs.cx/img17/9756/10001043dv.th.jpg (http://img17.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img17&image=10001043dv.jpg)

Oh yeah, I finished cutting out my body today. Had to do something. :D

http://img17.exs.cx/img17/6055/10001175kv.th.jpg (http://img17.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img17&image=10001175kv.jpg)

[dkitt]

dkitt, here is a pic of the cypress. This stuff is 1 1/2" thick, 5 1/2" wide. A bit thin for your needs, but its a good representation of what I got. I may have some that hasnt been milled yet, I'll check, but it will take some digging. Click the pic for a bigger image.


Just, Gorgeous grain pattern there - how heavy (dense) is it compared to other woods? Density seems to be measured by something called ASG - don't know what it stands for. Typical densities are:

Mahogany ASG = 0.40
Basswood ASG = 0.37
Alder ASG = 0.41
Ebony ASG = 0.82
Hard Maple ASG = 0.63
Sitka Spruce ASG = 0.40
White Pine ASG = 0.35
Rosewood ASG = 0.71

Slip, Did you say you used a sanding drum with a router. I just tried that today, and it wasn't pretty. The max. recommended rpm is something like 3600 for the drums, and even the slowest speed on a variable router is something like 8000. I only had it on for a second but it vibrated so much I could barely hold it - had to pull the plug in a big hurry!

Looks like the only other option is to run down to Home depot tommorrow and buy a drill press, and one of those robo-sanders with a template bearing Just mentioned.

[Slipstream]

Slipstream, I dont think I've ever seen one of those portable table saws that didnt have the fence handle broken. 9 out 10 of the those in operation have C clamps holding the fence true. Me thinks that yours has been bouncing around the back of your truck. You have western red, but if the wood is designated green, it means wet or uncured. WRC cures fast. Let set for awhile before you get into it. Here is a model of the work I do with cedars. Its a small display of room addition packages I make for dealers. This is at a show going on right now locally.The wood must have been in the store for some time, it's quite dry. I can tell. The green ones are noticably heavier. These are really light. On the saw, the handle is threaded, and it just came out. I could just put a bolt in there. It looks to be a 3/8 NC.

Slip, Did you say you used a sanding drum with a router. I just tried that today, and it wasn't pretty. The max. recommended rpm is something like 3600 for the drums, and even the slowest speed on a variable router is something like 8000. I only had it on for a second but it vibrated so much I could barely hold it - had to pull the plug in a big hurry!

Looks like the only other option is to run down to Home depot tommorrow and buy a drill press, and one of those robo-sanders with a template bearing Just mentioned.I got a set of different sizes of the drum sanders. I had problems with all but the largest one. Yeah the speed is a bit much for it.

[JustStartin]

My neck came just prior to lunch today, so I laid out and went to work on it. Heres the finished work, but I have a potential problem. I'll post the pics of how I did it after I get this figured out. Click the image for bigger view.
http://img236.exs.cx/img236/1929/10001227ng.th.jpg (http://img236.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img236&image=10001227ng.jpg)

I cut the pocket for the neck 5/8" deep. Which I though was the depth for strats and telecasters. Problem is The neck is just under 3/8" above the body. On my starter strat the neck only sticks past the body a 1/4". I think I'm to high above the body with the neck.

Any of you guys with telecasters, when you measure from the side of the heel, not the face, how far does the neck rise from the body. :confuse: This neck I got, I believe is thicker in the heel than standard fender necks.

Is it me, or this that fret board fat.

[dkitt]

You have the same dimensions as my Tele - 5/8" neck pocket depth (Pickup cavities are 3/4"), heel thickness inc. board is 1" and the neck extends above the body 3/8", so everything is exaclty as Leo planned it.

[Slipstream]

Is it just the light, or are those frets golden? I know, incandescent lighting to fool me and make me drool. :)

[JustStartin]

http://img232.exs.cx/img232/951/10001185um.th.jpg (http://img232.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img232&image=10001185um.jpg)http://img232.exs.cx/img232/1074/10001215zf.th.jpg (http://img232.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img232&image=10001215zf.jpg)http://img90.exs.cx/img90/5559/10001206xr.th.jpg (http://img90.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img90&image=10001206xr.jpg)

Pic 1) Shows the template I cut for the neck. What is doesnt show is the jig I made to cut it out. What it also doesnt show is the 5 or 6 previous ones I made, that were crap. The batteries are toast in my digital, but I show the jig for the template when I pick up new batteries tommorrow.

Pic 2) Shows the finished cut out. About 5 passes with the router.

Pic 3) Axe with neck.

The only other problem I have is the neck rocks in the pocket. I thought the cutout was screwed up, but its the base of the neck. Looks like I'll need to pull a 1/32" of and inch out of it to make it flat. That will probobly turn into a 1/16" by the time I'm done. Shouldnt hurt me.

Thanks for the rapid aid. You guys were Johnny on the spot with that. :D

Slipstream, I didnt even realize it but yes the frets are gold. The dots are pearloid. The pic doesnt show much, the thing is covered in dust and my finger prints. EBay 54.98 with shipping. Came off a New York Pro. A cheap strat copy. I think its one of those lawsuit guitars. The guy is dismantling them, and selling the alder bodies and necks separately. Hes getting more for them in pieces than they were selling for whole. Came with tuners too. Grover knockoffs. The thing is straight, medium frets. No complaints on my end.

dkitt, I'll be getting into that cypress later this week. I'll let you know if got anything thick enough for ya. As far as density, I'd say .50 going by the ratings you posted. They rate mahogany at .40. The stuff I have is right up there with rock maple.

As for cutting out the neck. There is no easy way. Its a tedious PITA. Just have to stay at it till you get it right. The tutorial at project guitar is a joke. Its FOS. You need jigs or templates with a router. Any dope who does it freehand is doomed. More guitar bodies will get maimed reading that crap than I care to mention.

[dkitt]

[QUOTE=JustStartin
As for cutting out the neck. There is no easy way. Its a tedious PITA. Just have to stay at it till you get it right. The tutorial at project guitar is a joke. Its FOS. You need jigs or templates with a router. Any dope who does it freehand is doomed. More guitar bodies will get maimed reading that crap than I care to mention.[/QUOTE]

Yep, I learned that the hard way, cutting the bucker cavities on my Tele. I couldn't find a template bit with a top bearing in a 1/4" width and 3/4" depth, so I decided to cut it out free hand with a bristolboard template I taped to the body, using the standard bit I had. I managed to make the edges reasonably straight in the end. but only after an endless careful hand sanding.

What kind of router bit did you use?

I bought a drill press on Sunday and got some good tips on making a stationary template guide for the drill table.
Home Depot doesn't sell robo-sanders.:mad:

[JustStartin]

[QUOTE=JustStartin
As for cutting out the neck. There is no easy way. Its a tedious PITA. Just have to stay at it till you get it right. The tutorial at project guitar is a joke. Its FOS. You need jigs or templates with a router. Any dope who does it freehand is doomed. More guitar bodies will get maimed reading that crap than I care to mention.

Yep, I learned that the hard way, cutting the bucker cavities on my Tele. I couldn't find a template bit with a top bearing in a 1/4" width and 3/4" depth, so I decided to cut it out free hand with a bristolboard template I taped to the body, using the standard bit I had. I managed to make the edges reasonably straight in the end. but only after an endless careful hand sanding.

What kind of router bit did you use?

I bought a drill press on Sunday and got some good tips on making a stationary template guide for the drill table.
Home Depot doesn't sell robo-sanders.:mad:[/QUOTE]

I used a top bearing bits. 1/2" diameter, 1" length, and a 1/2" diameter, 1/2" length. Not because they're the optimum sizes, they're what I had. My template was 5/8" thick. I used the 1/2" length bit for the first cuts, cuz you dont need to cut as deep, as I would with the 1" length bit. I went to the 1" length when i needed the deeper cuts. You have to do multiple passes or you'll get blowouts sure thing. The bits had 1/4" shanks. 1/2" shanks would of been much better. I also wish my bits were sharper. Would of been easier going.
They have top bearing bits on ebay. I checked, one store is selling them for a buy it now of $9 + 4 shipping. Thats a steal. $13 dollars for a 1/2" diameter 1" length. I think I paid around $22 a peice for the ones I have about 3-4 years ago. I didnt even use the robo. I bought a drum sanding kit at Klingspor.
All 2" heights, various diameters.

What kind of drill press did ya get! :D

[JustStartin]

dkitt, if you're going with the mighty mite strat neck, I'd get some templates. Check these out. I just found them on ebay.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=47069&item=7307457962&rd=1

I'll never make my own again. Way to time consuming and aggravating. If I make another guitar, I'm definetely going to score a set of these. I'll bet you could get them for the $6.95 tab too. He has a set for tele's also. Check out his store.

[SGshredder]

Awesome guys. Power to ya.

[Slipstream]

http://img232.exs.cx/img232/951/10001185um.th.jpg (http://img232.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img232&image=10001185um.jpg)http://img232.exs.cx/img232/1074/10001215zf.th.jpg (http://img232.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img232&image=10001215zf.jpg)http://img90.exs.cx/img90/5559/10001206xr.th.jpg (http://img90.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img90&image=10001206xr.jpg)

Pic 1) Shows the template I cut for the neck. What is doesnt show is the jig I made to cut it out. What it also doesnt show is the 5 or 6 previous ones I made, that were crap. The batteries are toast in my digital, but I show the jig for the template when I pick up new batteries tommorrow.

Pic 2) Shows the finished cut out. About 5 passes with the router.

Pic 3) Axe with neck.

The only other problem I have is the neck rocks in the pocket. I thought the cutout was screwed up, but its the base of the neck. Looks like I'll need to pull a 1/32" of and inch out of it to make it flat. That will probobly turn into a 1/16" by the time I'm done. Shouldnt hurt me.

Thanks for the rapid aid. You guys were Johnny on the spot with that. :D

Slipstream, I didnt even realize it but yes the frets are gold. The dots are pearloid. The pic doesnt show much, the thing is covered in dust and my finger prints. EBay 54.98 with shipping. Came off a New York Pro. A cheap strat copy. I think its one of those lawsuit guitars. The guy is dismantling them, and selling the alder bodies and necks separately. Hes getting more for them in pieces than they were selling for whole. Came with tuners too. Grover knockoffs. The thing is straight, medium frets. No complaints on my end.

dkitt, I'll be getting into that cypress later this week. I'll let you know if got anything thick enough for ya. As far as density, I'd say .50 going by the ratings you posted. They rate mahogany at .40. The stuff I have is right up there with rock maple.

As for cutting out the neck. There is no easy way. Its a tedious PITA. Just have to stay at it till you get it right. The tutorial at project guitar is a joke. Its FOS. You need jigs or templates with a router. Any dope who does it freehand is doomed. More guitar bodies will get maimed reading that crap than I care to mention.Sounds like the material ya hafta take off the neck is compatible with the excess height of the neck sticking above the body. Should come out close to what you expected in the first place.

Gold frets by accident - you dog. I can't even buy 'em anywhere, unless I get oversize and grind 'em down, or make my own . . . hmmm.

[dkitt]

dkitt, if you're going with the mighty mite strat neck, I'd get some templates. Check these out. I just found them on ebay.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=47069&item=7307457962&rd=1

I'll never make my own again. Way to time consuming and aggravating. If I make another guitar, I'm definetely going to score a set of these. I'll bet you could get them for the $6.95 tab too. He has a set for tele's also. Check out his store.

I've already bought the LP mightymite neck...and lo and behold, it STILL hasn't arrived yet! :mad:
I also have the body wood and proper templates for the two bucker cavities - I just don't have the proper router bits.Something I have finished though is the body template. I have a pic of it but I can't upload anything until I have all the photos and take my camera to a netcafe - my computer isn't compatible with my camera.

I'll take your advice and look for some of those bits you mentioned on Ebay.

[JustStartin]

http://img169.exs.cx/img169/8052/10001240so.th.jpg (http://img169.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img169&image=10001240so.jpg)http://img169.exs.cx/img169/4416/10001321ui.th.jpg (http://img169.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img169&image=10001321ui.jpg)http://img169.exs.cx/img169/3531/10001299ns.th.jpg (http://img169.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img169&image=10001299ns.jpg)

Pic 1) Shows cutting out the rear contour. I used a drum sander in a power drill. I took the wheel off the robo sander and used it. I used the robo cuz it had a 50 grain sleeve on it. You'd be amazed how much material you can remove with 50 grain. I'll take this over a spoke shave any day. Once I started digging into the contour, I loved how the grain lines followed the contour of the guitar. Nice surprise for me there. :)
No big plan for doing this. I drew lines on the back and sides of the guitar as guides. After I started cutting, I just set the guitar against my expanding waistline, and just cut away till it felt right. Kinda custom contoured.

Pic 2) Shows the slight contour I put on the front. I did this with a 4x24 belt sander. I DONT advise this method. I couldnt contour it much cuz I'd cut through the quilt. I took a little more than I wanted to, but a belt sander will do that to ya. I have just enough material at the bottom of the contour for a 1/4" radius on the edge.

Pic 3) Thats after I sanded out the 50 grain marks with 80 grain. I'll probobly radius the edges tommorrow night.

I'm gonna be on ice for awhile. I need to order a neck plate. Real genius, orders a neck and no plate. :o I think I inhaled about a pound of mahogany cutting that rear contour. Need a mask. cough!

[GuitarDude636]

wow, this is turning out really nice! love the looks of it.

Good Job man!

[JustStartin]

wow, this is turning out really nice! love the looks of it.

Good Job man!

Thanks G-dude, so far so good.

I spent the last hour looking at the axe. Amber is to light and butterscotch is to dark. I hate having to mix stains, but that looks inevitable.

I sold on going with P-90's on a humbucker bobbin. I can go to buckers later if I want to. A gibson type wiring set up, 1 tone and 1 volume control for each pickup with a 3 way switch. I'm pretty much clueless on wiring, but I'll get something figured out. Suggestions appreciated.

I'm going to order the rest of the gear this weekend. Some snipers have been punking me on last minute bids on fleabay. :mad2: I'm going the buy it now path. What gets me is these toolbags end up bidding more than the buy it now price the seller has listed if you visit his store. :rolleyes:

Can anyone recommend a good stripper? I'm leaning twards losing the finish on the neck I bought. Its not poor quality, but I want a tongue oil finish on the fretboard.

[dkitt]

Can anyone recommend a good stripper? I'm leaning twards losing the finish on the neck I bought. Its not poor quality, but I want a tongue oil finish on the fretboard.

Just sand it off. If you use a paint stripper it creates a lot of sludge which might get into the rosewood pores - its too messy.

I hate those necks with the yellow/amber finish some companies use.

I just put a rubbed-on varathane on the unfinished neck I bought.
I think its best to get a very hard varathane that can be used for floors.
I used a soft varnish on my Tele neck and its worn through in one place already - thats why I bought varathane this time. A neck should be as frictionless as possible. :hmmm:

[Slipstream]

I would agree with the sanding. The tung oil I think is a good call. It's a hardening oil, like boiled linseed oil, but unlike raw linseed oil - which is one of the non-hardening oils. I plan to do that on my ebony fingerboard when I get it. Then for the bloodwood I have some liquid solvent-based wax (no silicone).

But what do I know? I put drum sanders in routers. :)

Actually I got an attachment for my drill so I can use that for my drum sander. Oh yeah, and I got a 6" bolt for the saw rip-fence. Works fine for a handle.

[JustStartin]

You guys are right on the stripping. I wasnt sure about the stripper either. I'm hesitant to use any abrasive on the fingerboard between the frets. The frets are finished nicely on the neck I got. Polished to boot. I may go with steel wool.

Slipstream, I love tongue oil. Drys fast and hard, and provides a nice sheen to the wood. I hate linseed oil. Greasy, slow drying and doesnt last nearly as long as tongue oil does. No experience with the boiled variety, that may work also. The tongue oil will look sweet on that ebony. Thanks for bringing up the drum sanders earlier. They are now my best freind.

dkitt, I'd bet good money Zachary is using tongue oil on his guitars. Steel wool that verathane. Its a polyurethane, steel wool #0000, superfine, will make that neck slick.

Do any of you guys know of a good link for setting a bridge? I understand scale, but the positioning of the saddles when measuring has me confused. The stuff I've come across thus far is inconsistant to say the least.

[shiggity]

Thanks G-dude, so far so good.

I spent the last hour looking at the axe. Amber is to light and butterscotch is to dark. I hate having to mix stains, but that looks inevitable.

I sold on going with P-90's on a humbucker bobbin. I can go to buckers later if I want to. A gibson type wiring set up, 1 tone and 1 volume control for each pickup with a 3 way switch. I'm pretty much clueless on wiring, but I'll get something figured out. Suggestions appreciated.

I'm going to order the rest of the gear this weekend. Some snipers have been punking me on last minute bids on fleabay. :mad2: I'm going the buy it now path. What gets me is these toolbags end up bidding more than the buy it now price the seller has listed if you visit his store. :rolleyes:

Can anyone recommend a good stripper? I'm leaning twards losing the finish on the neck I bought. Its not poor quality, but I want a tongue oil finish on the fretboard.


Lucy down at Mr Happys puts on a hell of a show! :D

[Slipstream]

You guys are right on the stripping. I wasnt sure about the stripper either. I'm hesitant to use any abrasive on the fingerboard between the frets. The frets are finished nicely on the neck I got. Polished to boot. I may go with steel wool.

Slipstream, I love tongue oil. Drys fast and hard, and provides a nice sheen to the wood. I hate linseed oil. Greasy, slow drying and doesnt last nearly as long as tongue oil does. No experience with the boiled variety, that may work also. The tongue oil will look sweet on that ebony. Thanks for bringing up the drum sanders earlier. They are now my best freind.

dkitt, I'd bet good money Zachary is using tongue oil on his guitars. Steel wool that verathane. Its a polyurethane, steel wool #0000, superfine, will make that neck slick.

Do any of you guys know of a good link for setting a bridge? I understand scale, but the positioning of the saddles when measuring has me confused. The stuff I've come across thus far is inconsistant to say the least.I've got a good link for the bridge placement, just gotta find it. I got a bazillion links. As I recall, it said the treble end goes at the scale length, and the bass end goes 1/8" back (further from the neck). The 1/8" I'm sure about, which end goes forward or back I'm not. I'll post it when I find it.

About the linseed oil, the raw oil is like what oil paint artists use. It makes oil paint glossy, but takes forever and a day to dry. The boiled linseed oil dries to the touch in a matter of hours, and cures well overnight (if it's not cold).

I don't remember if I mentioned it, but I put tung oil on my SG fingerboard when I first got it. I buffed it when it dryed, and now all I do is clean it when I change strings. Just buffing it with a towel.



Edit: The link I had was for acoustics, but this might help ya: Stewart MadDonald - Electric Guitar and Bass Assembly Guide (http://www.stewmac.com/cgi-bin/hazel.cgi?action=SERVE&sku=I-4003&PG=3&s1=Free_info_sheets&item=freeinfo/fi.html)

[Slipstream]

Here's a P-90 wiring diagram:

http://www.seymourduncan.com/website/support/schematics/schematicsjpg/standard_p90.jpg

[JustStartin]

Slipstream, Thanks for the linkage. The P-90 wiring diagram is just what I will need. It's idiot proof. I need that when dealing with electronics.

Shiggity, Where is Mr. Happy's??? I dont know, Cookie Valantine was the best. She worked the Palamino in Vegas back around 1988. A total goddess. This is another thread, I think you should start it. :D

[dkitt]

Slipstream, I love tongue oil. Drys fast and hard, and provides a nice sheen to the wood. I hate linseed oil. Greasy, slow drying and doesnt last nearly as long as tongue oil does. No experience with the boiled variety, that may work also. The tongue oil will look sweet on that ebony. Thanks for bringing up the drum sanders earlier. They are now my best freind.

dkitt, I'd bet good money Zachary is using tongue oil on his guitars. Steel wool that verathane. Its a polyurethane, steel wool #0000, superfine, will make that neck slick.

Do any of you guys know of a good link for setting a bridge? I understand scale, but the positioning of the saddles when measuring has me confused. The stuff I've come across thus far is inconsistant to say the least.

The hardest version of tung oil I know of is 'polymerized' tung oil sold by leevalley.com. It is the only kind they sell which is hard enough for floors.
Its given a heat treatment (which makes it thicker) and then thinned down with varsol.

I use a rubbed-on method on the neck, so the finish is IN the wood, not ON the wood. As long as the wood has been polished up to 400 grit its as smooth as silk when the varathane is dry.=o)

[JustStartin]

The hardest version of tung oil I know of is 'polymerized' tung oil sold by leevalley.com. It is the only kind they sell which is hard enough for floors.
Its given a heat treatment (which makes it thicker) and then thinned down with varsol.

I use a rubbed-on method on the neck, so the finish is IN the wood, not ON the wood. As long as the wood has been polished up to 400 grit its as smooth as silk when the varathane is dry.=o)

Nice! The neck does feel great after fine sanding. Are you still interested in that cypress? Sorry I havent gotten to checking what I have. I definetely will do it.

I got my neck plate in the mail today, and attached the neck. I sanded the back of the neck, and tested some stain on some sample pieces of white wood(spruce) I had laying around. I liked it, and did the back of the neck with it. Blended in sweet with the mahogany. I may do the quilt with this color, havent decided yet. Pic below, click it and the stain color is more visible. I just didnt like the white maple going into the mahogany. The light brown stain really brought out the grain in the neck. The pic came out ratty. I've been knocking down my latest English Bitters(beer) this afternoon, and I'm not to steady with the camera. :(

http://img163.exs.cx/img163/2440/10001367zq.th.jpg (http://img163.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img163&image=10001367zq.jpg)

The gold plate looks killer with the mahogany. Cant wait to get some clear coat on it.

[GuitarDude636]

Wow that looks great, its cool watching it come along.

What are you going to set it up with once your done with all the wood work?

[Slipstream]

That is NICE! Wish mine was comin' along like that. Best not be in a hurry though. Good work. That mahongony is beautiful.

[FrEtboaRDonFIRE]

Wow...that is all I have to say besides GOOD WORK!!!! Keep up the guitar buildin' dude! It's sure comin' along nice!

Rock on,

-=FoF=-

[dkitt]

Nice! The neck does feel great after fine sanding. Are you still interested in that cypress? Sorry I havent gotten to checking what I have. I definetely will do it.

I got my neck plate in the mail today, and attached the neck. I sanded the back of the neck, and tested some stain on some sample pieces of white wood(spruce) I had laying around. I liked it, and did the back of the neck with it. Blended in sweet with the mahogany. I may do the quilt with this color, havent decided yet. Pic below, click it and the stain color is more visible. I just didnt like the white maple going into the mahogany. The light brown stain really brought out the grain in the neck. The pic came out ratty. I've been knocking down my latest English Bitters(beer) this afternoon, and I'm not to steady with the camera. :(
.

You know I've seen rosewood Teles before (in pictures), but no mahogany...so in that sense, your creation is totally unique! The Telecaster is the brightest of all guitars, so I imagine the mahogany will mellow the tone a bit.

Is that a trick of the light or did you get a neck with some lateral flaming?:hmmm:

If you made a custom stain colour you should problably keep some squirreled away - stain doesn't penetrate a dense wood like maple very deeply and will wear off in spots eventually, requiring a stain touch-up.

Something else I did tonight was make a dark brown pore filler that I'm testing on an old rosewwod neck. You notice how the pores fill up with dust and turn into white streaks after a while?

I'd be interested in the cypress but only if you have some lighter pieces,
nothing over ASG 0.43 say. If its as heavy as maple, as you've said, the tone will be too bright methinks. The best guitars imo have heavy dense necks and light bodies. I prefer the sound of an SG over a LP anyday...in spite of my obvious Zeppelin fetish.

[JustStartin]

Thanks for the encouragement guys. I appreciated it. :)

dkitt, I've seen a tele which was a mahogany body with an arched flame top. The top was a veneer. I saw another with an alder back and flame top. The top on that one was only 1/8" thick. The later had the conventional tele style, flat front and back. The archtop went for $600 and the conventional style went for $1350. I dont get it. Those prices from an online dealer, samedaymusic.com. Both were alot more at the local Music Store.

I didnt mix that stain. It was an old can I had buried on the back of the shelf. Definetely though, I need to keep in mind to remember what I'm mixing when I hit on the right shade for that quilt. I knew someone would notice that figuring in the neck. :D Its more pronounced at the base of the neck and fades as it reaches the head stock. I wasnt even noticeable with the thin coat of lacquer on the neck, but it came alive with the light brown tinted stain. I was pumped to say the least. I'll be hitting it with a thin coat of lacquer later.

Definetely notice the saw dust in the fret board like you said. I steelwooled all the fiinish of the fret board this afternoon. Good luck with the filler. Let me know what you used.

[dkitt]

I used Elmer's wood filler in tubes (walnut colour). I mixed it with water and a small amount of black universal pigment used to tint paint. You just rub it on, let it dry, and then rub the excess off with methyl hydrate (alcohol).

If I ever make another another Tele I'd like to do a striped version like this one I saw on Ebay.

http://img109.exs.cx/img109/3447/0512sb8hx.jpg

[JustStartin]

I used Elmer's wood filler in tubes (walnut colour). I mixed it with water and a small amount of black universal pigment used to tint paint. You just rub it on, let it dry, and then rub the excess off with methyl hydrate (alcohol).

If I ever make another another Tele I'd like to do a striped version like this one I saw on Ebay.

http://img109.exs.cx/img109/3447/0512sb8hx.jpg


Like it! What woods did he use in the glue up? Looks like cypress? in the middle, some dark wood stripes, and ash? for the wings.

[dkitt]

Like it! What woods did he use in the glue up? Looks like cypress? in the middle, some dark wood stripes, and ash? for the wings.

The wings are swamp ash and the dark stripes are walnut - not sure about the center block.
I wanted to edit my last post but ITS TOO LATE! :mad: Varsol works much better than acohol for rubbing off the excess pore filler I've discovered. The alcohol leeches too much oil out of the wood and makes it look dry - good thing I have an old neck to experiment on.

Bought the pups last night on ebay for about half what Stewmac is chargeing. Now I'm on the hunt for tuners. :crossed:

[JustStartin]

The wings are swamp ash and the dark stripes are walnut - not sure about the center block.
I wanted to edit my last post but ITS TOO LATE! :mad: Varsol works much better than acohol for rubbing off the excess pore filler I've discovered. The alcohol leeches too much oil out of the wood and makes it look dry - good thing I have an old neck to experiment on.

Bought the pups last night on ebay for about half what Stewmac is chargeing. Now I'm on the hunt for tuners. :crossed:

Great to hear you got the pups. Did you go with buckers? I was going to buy the rest of my gear over the weekend, but once I added everything up I got :eeksgn:

I'm running over budget. Compromises may have to made, or I may have to build up a cash reserve. What kind of tuners are you looking for? I have a set of silver gotoh/grover style. I cant use them, I need pimp gold. The have a SS stamp on the back. I have no idea what that means, maybe someone here knows.

[dkitt]

Great to hear you got the pups. Did you go with buckers? I was going to buy the rest of my gear over the weekend, but once I added everything up I got :eeksgn:

I'm running over budget. Compromises may have to made, or I may have to build up a cash reserve. What kind of tuners are you looking for? I have a set of silver gotoh/grover style. I cant use them, I need pimp gold. The have a SS stamp on the back. I have no idea what that means, maybe someone here knows.

Yeah, I got two buckers with Gibson style chrome covers. They are made exactly like PAFs right down to the fine details like wire guage, nickel-plated base plates and cloth insulation.

Ideally, I like to get Grover mini locking tuners in nickel, but as I'm allergic to wasting money, who knows what I'll end up with. Interesting, there are more great Ebay deals on gold tuners than chrome, in spite of the fact that gold hardware is more expensive.

I didn't want gold because it wouldn't match everything else - it also wears off MUCH faster.

[unclebobscircus]

Yeah, I got two buckers with Gibson style chrome covers. They are made exactly like PAFs right down to the fine details like wire guage, nickel-plated base plates and cloth insulation.

Ideally, I like to get Grover mini locking tuners in nickel, but as I'm allergic to wasting money, who knows what I'll end up with. Interesting, there are more great Ebay deals on gold tuners than chrome, in spite of the fact that gold hardware is more expensive.

I didn't want gold because it wouldn't match everything else - it also wears off MUCH faster.
That last part is completely true - the gold on my SG's stop tailpiece has worn off, leaving this silver patch.

[Slipstream]

Great to hear you got the pups. Did you go with buckers? I was going to buy the rest of my gear over the weekend, but once I added everything up I got :eeksgn:

I'm running over budget. Compromises may have to made, or I may have to build up a cash reserve. What kind of tuners are you looking for? I have a set of silver gotoh/grover style. I cant use them, I need pimp gold. The have a SS stamp on the back. I have no idea what that means, maybe someone here knows.If they're silver colored and have SS stamped on 'em it probably means Stainless Steel.

[JustStartin]

http://i145.exs.cx/img145/2845/10001423hk.th.jpg (http://img145.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img145&image=10001423hk.jpg)http://img197.exs.cx/img197/5951/10001432kz.th.jpg (http://img197.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img197&image=10001432kz.jpg)

I set the bridge this morning.
Slipstream, thanks for that link on bridge placement. I missed it when you first posted it. It made it crystal clear.

My benchtop press didnt have the clearance from the chuck to the support pole to enable me to do a righteous string thru the body bridge. A buddy of mine has a floor model drill press, so I used his. Problem is, the spindle in his is shot. I used it anyway. No other option, and I'm not buying a new drill press.

Pic 1) Shows the bridge from the front. I also put a light stain on the fret board to even it out. To streaky for my taste. The stain evened it out nicely.

Pic 2) Shows the back. What it doesnt show is, the hole second from the left is off. The unstable spindle caused the bit to walk and poke thu the other side about a fat 1/32" out of line. :mad:

It wont be an issue though. I have to counter bore the back holes 1/4" to install the ferrules(sp). I'll just have to jig it up so the ferrules are in a perfectly straight line.

Hopefully I'll have all the routing done next weekend. I ordered a set of pup templates from ebay. I'd do my own, but dont have the pups yet. They'll be the last thing I order. Once I get the routing done, I can start doing the finish on the body. :smile:

[Slipstream]

Too bad about the bit wandering. I hope the counter-bores work out ok. Comin' along nice man. I dig the gold hardware.

[JustStartin]

dkitt,
We were doing a bit of milling today, and I ran across some of that cypress I was talking about. I have some rough cut 2" stock buried in the racks. Here is a sampling of it. I planed it down to 1 7/8". I have more than I thought, and this stuff isnt that boiler farm crap, its old growth. Tight growth rings with nice density. Talk about a sweet bell tone when tapped with a hammer. Its also been curing for a good 2 years. Here are some pics. Its a combo of flat and straight grain. The last pic will explain the grain patterns.

http://img188.exs.cx/img188/9775/10001450jl.th.jpg (http://img188.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img188&image=10001450jl.jpg)http://img188.exs.cx/img188/9219/10001473uu.th.jpg (http://img188.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img188&image=10001473uu.jpg)

Pic 1) Just a sample pic

Pic 2) Dead azz heart wood. The very core of the tree. You cant count the growth rings. Those cuts are from the same timber, not random boards. I graded out the knots.

Most of the wood I buy is heart, since I order timbers. 4X dimensional stuff. I'll be getting through the rest of it in a week or so, stay tuned. I may have some stuff thats grabs ya. :D

You can click the pics for a better look.

[Skymx99]

Looks awesome man. I take it that is a neck off of a strat?

BTW... I couldn't help but notice the old IT 490 Yamaha in the garage. I race motocross and my dad had one of those a LONG time ago.

[JustStartin]

Looks awesome man. I take it that is a neck off of a strat?

BTW... I couldn't help but notice the old IT 490 Yamaha in the garage. I race motocross and my dad had one of those a LONG time ago.

Hey man, It wasnt that long ago!!!! I'll have you know that relic finished the Blackwater 100 with me aboard in 88. I'll admit the only way I finished that nightmare was the drunks grabbing my handle bars and pulling me out of the river mud bank crossing. It was beautiful. It was a fitting close to my enduro, harescramble, money pit racing career. That bike will never be sold. How many riders have finished Blackwater??????

Its actually a 200, but with punching the cylinders and porting, its probobly a 225cc.

I'm still riding that fossil, and my son is on a yz 250.
Keep riding, it stretches your physical and mental boundaries. It will be a positive influence on everything you do in the future. :smile:

The neck on the axe is from a strat copy. A lawsuit guitar. The seller on ebay is disassembling the guitars and selling them out as parts.

Sincerely,
a member of the over the bars brotherhood.
Juststartin
:D

[Skymx99]

thats pretty cool man. I dunno much about enduro's but I do know the blackwater 100 is Gnarly. If you got any other pics, please post em. :)

[dkitt]

I haven't posted anything on this thread for a while cause I made a BIG booboo.
I decided to use longer router bit WITHOUT a bearing guide to rout the neck pocket on the center body board (the body is made out of 3 boards which I haven't glued together yet) - BIG mistake.

The bit spins so fast that it melted the plastic/acylic template I was using and created a slightly wavy line - you should have seen the look of total horror on my face!

Luckily, I don't have to replace the whole body, just the center board. I already have it on order.

No more plastic templates without a bearing guide... :mad:

P.S. I did get some nice tuners though. I'm using the same G+L style bridge as Just. Only thing left to buy is the controls.

[JustStartin]

I haven't posted anything on this thread for a while cause I made a BIG booboo.
I decided to use longer router bit WITHOUT a bearing guide to rout the neck pocket on the center body board (the body is made out of 3 boards which I haven't glued together yet) - BIG mistake.

The bit spins so fast that it melted the plastic/acylic template I was using and created a slightly wavy line - you should have seen the look of total horror on my face!

Luckily, I don't have to replace the whole body, just the center board. I already have it on order.

No more plastic templates without a bearing guide... :mad:

P.S. I did get some nice tuners though. I'm using the same G+L style bridge as Just. Only thing left to buy is the controls.

Jezzus kitt, tell me you didnt follow that nimrod "how to" at project guitar on hand routering a neck pocket. :mad:
Thick templates are the best. I made 5/8" templates and used two separate depth, top bearing bits. They allow you gradual depth cuts with no blowout.

Monkeying in my shop, I have accurate strat and tele neck templates. 5/8" thick. You should of called. PM me. I'll send you copies of the the plates. There right. Balls accurate. :D

[dkitt]

Jezzus kitt, tell me you didnt follow that nimrod "how to" at project guitar on hand routering a neck pocket. :mad:
Thick templates are the best. I made 5/8" templates and used two separate depth, top bearing bits. They allow you gradual depth cuts with no blowout.

Monkeying in my shop, I have accurate strat and tele neck templates. 5/8" thick. You should of called. PM me. I'll send you copies of the the plates. There right. Balls accurate. :D

I recall reading something on that site about hand routing WITHOUT any template - plastic or otherwise. That would be suicidal....but they didn't warn me about melting plastic templates either. Just goes to show you how completely useless that site is.:p

I've already made another template out of 1/4" masonite - but I'm going to test it first - to the max. Maybe it will catch fire , or something equally dramatic.:rolleye:

[JustStartin]

Thin templates are worthless, unless being used for cutting thicker ones.

When using thin templates, the tutorials I've seen have recommended boring out the the neck mortise with forstner bits or drill bits. Thin templates require that you have to bore deep with the router bit. NOT GOOD! Boring out the the meat of the material with drill bits lessens the burden on the router. Okay, sound thought in that respect.

Punching holes with drill bits seem like waste of time to me. Thus my use of thick templates. Its all about the material removed with each pass of the router. Thick templates allow material removal at light interval. 1/8" per pass.

I'll make a bold statement here. As far as precision work with a router, send me the best that Gibson, Fender, PMS, GnL or project guitar has to offer. I'll drop em!!!! Take away their CNC and they're *****. I have the background to prove it.

Building a neck, fretwork, I'm a babe in the woods, but if you're following the advice of these guitar tutorials.....BEWARE!

There are some incredibly talented individuals posting on luthier forums, and an equal amount of idiots. Use your head, and look close at finished gear. Guys like Brian Calvert are immensely talented, but at the same time posts idiotic misleading tutorials by members of his forum. The guitar body build tutorial is tragic. If I got my hands on the idiot who posted that tutorial, I'd snap his BS pencil neck. I like the way he had a dial caliper in every pic, when hand routering his neck pocket. ASSH*le!

Check out Lex Luthier. This guy is in his early 20's, but has ammassed tooling, skills, and experience that make me drool. The real deal.

[TheVaiApprentic]

Since its been a little while since anyones posted here, I figure I will.

Your guys' guitars are looking awesome. I'm starting to build my own guitar with the daddy-o. Its going to be the classic super-strat shape. all ibanez JEM like, but first were going to build a body on scrap wood, since i've never built anything out of wood (cept fires ;) ) and he's only built some furniture. I'll try to put some pictures up as it goes along.

[Slipstream]

Looking forward to seein' the pics! I've been waitin' for better weather, and working on some other stuff (mixing/mastering stuff), so I haven't made any progress on the build.

[Etingi]

I wish that I had all that woodworking equipment (and knowledge). I would love to make my own custom Strat instead of paying $2500 for the one I like, but I wouldn't have any idea where to start.

[Slipstream]

I wish that I had all that woodworking equipment (and knowledge). I would love to make my own custom Strat instead of paying $2500 for the one I like, but I wouldn't have any idea where to start.Take a woodshop class. They have all the tools and equip. ya need. Plus the instructor might have some good ideas for ya. I'll bet the instructor is a guitar player himself (or herself, whatever).

[Etingi]

I took a woodshop class in school, but I still wouldn't be able to make a guitar if I wanted to.

[Slipstream]

Maybe one of these days, huh?

[JustStartin]

I need some help on humbucker spacing. I got my templates when I got home for lunch. The distance from the base of the neck to the bridge base is 6 9/16". Its a two humbucker setup. The pups I'm getting are actually P-90's mounted on a humbucker bobbin. I doubt that matters, but thought I'd mention it.

I'm looking for center to center dimensions. Is the distance between the pups that critical, or am I just being anal retentive? I'm going to leave just enough space between the neck and pup route for a pickup ring.

Any assistance is appreciated. :)

[Slipstream]

I have no idea man. I looked around some, couldn't find anything helpful - just plans you can buy. I'm going with just a neck pup on mine. I would make the space from the bridge pup to the bridge the same as the distance from the neck pup to the fingerboard, but that's just a looks thing rather than a sound thing.

[Icarus169]

I took a woodshop class in school, but I still wouldn't be able to make a guitar if I wanted to.

How do you know that?, even if you aren't the most 'handy'man out there, it doesn't mean you can't build a guitar.
To buy a book about it is the first step.
Carefull planning and a lot of thinking the second
the right equipment and materials
then you just have to take it slow, think everything you do through and be very strict and precise.

It is a very good exercise to make a body and a neck out of crappy plain wood.
This way you get skilled in doing this without the chance of ruining a beautifull piece of wood.
A big part of building a great guitar is patience, that means that you always be very precise and accurate even if it goes very slow.

but the crap wood project is really a great training before you build the guitar, especially if your not that experienced with using the tools like for example a router.

[JustStartin]

I have no idea man. I looked around some, couldn't find anything helpful - just plans you can buy. I'm going with just a neck pup on mine. I would make the space from the bridge pup to the bridge the same as the distance from the neck pup to the fingerboard, but that's just a looks thing rather than a sound thing.

I looked around too, and couldnt find anything. Thanks for lookin though, I appreciate it. I'll just look at some pics and wing it. I wish I would of cut the heel on my neck flat. The ring up tight on the neck would of looked better with a flat heel. :hmmm:

My template collection is growing. I have a tele body, and strat neck pocket that I made. And I just got a set from ebay that contained a tele neck pocket, single coil, humbucker, tele bridge pup, and tremelo templates. :toohappy:

If you or dkitt want any copies. PM me. :D

[Slipstream]

Thanks, but I'm gonna design my own. Not definate yet, but I'm thinkin' a shape kinda like an acoustic.

[JustStartin]

Slipstream, one thing I wanted to ask you is, how are you going to shape the back of your neck? I've been thinking about how to go about doing a neck, and cant come up with an accurate way of contouring the back to the desired profile.
The fretboard seems simple enough using the appropriate radius sander, but I havent come across any router bits that would make a good profile for the back.

[Slipstream]

For the profile of the neck I was planning to lay out and cut the taper (looking at the face where the fingerboard gets attached) starting with a plunge-cut on the table saw. Then do the ends by the headstock and body with a jig saw. Cleaning up with a drum sander (not on a router :) ). Then on the back I'd use a draw knife and work it slow. Followed by sanding with various grits.

I know the draw-knife sounds like a lot of work, but the neck on my SG, and my Strat, are pretty thin. I figger once ya have the taper done, maybe using a 3/4 rounding-over bit might be a good start. Depends on the dimensions and the workability of the wood. I'll check the grain so the easy cutting direction is cool. I don't know if you've ever used a draw knife, but it only works good in one direction. Otherwise you can lift and break chunks of the wood.

For the fingerboard I plan to buy one radiused and slotted from Luthiers Mercantile. The frets will probably be those big gold ones I saw somewhere (I have it bookmarked somewhere).

[JustStartin]

For the profile of the neck I was planning to lay out and cut the taper (looking at the face where the fingerboard gets attached) starting with a plunge-cut on the table saw. Then do the ends by the headstock and body with a jig saw. Cleaning up with a drum sander (not on a router :) ). Then on the back I'd use a draw knife and work it slow. Followed by sanding with various grits.

I know the draw-knife sounds like a lot of work, but the neck on my SG, and my Strat, are pretty thin. I figger once ya have the taper done, maybe using a 3/4 rounding-over bit might be a good start. Depends on the dimensions and the workability of the wood. I'll check the grain so the easy cutting direction is cool. I don't know if you've ever used a draw knife, but it only works good in one direction. Otherwise you can lift and break chunks of the wood.

For the fingerboard I plan to buy one radiused and slotted from Luthiers Mercantile. The frets will probably be those big gold ones I saw somewhere (I have it bookmarked somewhere).

Man....I dont even know what a draw knife is. :confuse: Sounds like some tedious work. Good luck with it. looking forward to seeing it crafted.

I broke down and and scored my pups. Vintage Vibe P-90's on a humbucker bobbin.
http://i19.ebayimg.com/02/i/03/c8/2d/ff_1_b.JPG
The guy gets smokin reviews at harmony cental. Hand wound. Here are the specs:

The bridge pickup is wound clockwise, has a DC resistance of approximately 10.5 k-Ohm and its magnetic orientation is North up. The neck pickup is wound counter clockwise, has a DC resistance of approximately 8.9 k-Ohm and its magnetic orientation is South up. Both pickups have grounded shielding that is very effective in eliminating noise ffrom external electric fields.
Twin ceramic-8 magnets
Magnetic field strength designed for balance and warm tone
Vacuum potted in forming wax to eliminate microphonics
Shielded output leads
3-conductor wiring allows all possible wiring options
Each pickup includes a specifications sheet detailing:
Number of turns of wire
Winding direction
DC resistance
Magnetic polarity direction
Magnetic field strength
Installation notes
Wiring diagram with solder points indicated
Each pickup is individually hand crafted by custom guitar designer and builder Pete Biltoft at the Vintage Vibe Guitars Sound Lab in Livermore, California.

Well, the copy sounds good. I bought them based on his reviews, and the sound as described by the reviewers. I also liked the idea of having hand made pups in my guitar. I can get them in either black, cream, or faux tortoise shell. No gold dammit!!!! I may have to make my own covers.

[Slipstream]

Here's what a draw knife looks like:

http://www.redhillgeneralstore.com/pics/39059.jpg

Tedious? Yes, but then I once made an axe handle out of a tree branch with a hacksaw and a Buck knife. :)


You're probably going to be thrilled with yer pups. Seymour Duncan is hosting a wind-yer-own thing later this month. It's in Southern CA so it's too far. Would be cool to attend though.

This is where I read about it: Seymour Duncan (http://seymourduncan.com/forum/showthread.php?t=28613)

[JustStartin]

Here's what a draw knife looks like:

http://www.redhillgeneralstore.com/pics/39059.jpg

Tedious? Yes, but then I once made an axe handle out of a tree branch with a hacksaw and a Buck knife. :)


You're probably going to be thrilled with yer pups. Seymour Duncan is hosting a wind-yer-own thing later this month. It's in Southern CA so it's too far. Would be cool to attend though.

This is where I read about it: Seymour Duncan (http://seymourduncan.com/forum/showthread.php?t=28613)

You made an axe handle out of a tree branch with a hacksaw and buck knife!!! You could definetely hang in my neighborhood. The King of the Hill in these parts, is whoever has a project going on that anyone disses. Sample comment, "Slipstream, you coulda went down to the hardware store and bought that handle for $8.99." Those types making that comment, just dont get it!!!

About the pups, I could wrap bailing wire around 6 screws, and proclaim Seymour a peasant. Its all about marketing now. :D
Honestly, the guy making these pups is as helpful as you could wish for. Sent me his suggesting wiring diagrams for several different setups. He does alot of custom windings for experienced players. He is in Cali, you may want to check him out. Prices are reasonable also.

Is the draw knife a spoke shave? Looks similar. you'll need good hands to work that tool. As Nike says, DO IT! I'll check out Seymour's wind your own site.

[Slipstream]

When I made that axe handle I was in the Six Rivers National Forest, about 100 miles from the nearest hardware store, and I was living on my (at that time) 10% VA disability of $98/mo.

As for the pups, I'll check out the guy yer talkin' about. I was planning on a SD Pearly Gates though. Maybe a sustainiac too. They're like a feedback pickup that works opposite of a pickup, making the strings vibrate from the signal picked up by the other pup.

A spoke shave is a type of draw knife. They come with various length blades for different purposes. For shaving wheel spokes a short blade is all that's needed. They make 'em longer for strippin' bark off of logs, like for buildin' log cabins, and other stuff.

[JustStartin]

Slipstream, How long did you do the wilderness thing. I couldnt handle the isolation of it. I imagine it would be an outlook altering experience.
I love the sound of that "sustainiac". I know nada about guitar electronics, but it justs sounds so cool. Thats how I picked my wiring setup. The guy at VintageVibeGuitars.com highly recommended Deaf Eddies, Five Tone Tele set up. It incorporates a 4-pole, 24-lug, 5-throw SuperSwitch.
With the Five-Tone Tele scheme, you can select between:

NECK (plain ol' neck pup)
BRIDGE and NECK in SERIES (very Gibson-ish)
BRIDGE and NECK in PARALLEL (plain ol' Tele #2)
BRIDGE and NECK in SERIES/OUT OF PHASE(YIKES! What a stinger!)
and BRIDGE (plain ol' Tele bridge)

Those are Deaf Eddie's descriptions. Here is the wiring diagram, idiot proofed to boot. Just what I need. I like the way he has all the grounds tied together.
http://www.deaf-eddie.net/drawings/5-tone.jpg

[Slipstream]

That set-up ya got there looks like you can get quite a variety of sounds. Not idiot proof enough for me though. :) I'd rather change sounds with stomp boxes. I don't like to make adjustments on my guitar while I'm playin'. I leave my pup switch in one place (neck) all the time, and the volume and tone are always up full. When I'm playin' at a blues jam I'll play clean for rhythm, then when my turn comes for a lead part I stomp on my OD pedal - which adds distortion and volume - then I wail away for once or twice around. Then I'm back to clean.

The wilderness thing. Hmmm, hard to say really. I've been doing that sort of thing most of my life. The time I spent in the Six Rivers area the time I made the axe handle was about five months. A business I had in '91 went under, and I loaded up my truck and tools and bought a tent and some camping gear and just got away from it all. Once a month I'd get a can of tobacco, sack of potatoes, bag of flour, bag of grapefruits, some gas, some dog food, stuff like that. Oh yeah, and a jug of wine.

When I get stressed out and need to meditate on a "happy place" I think of sitting on the banks of the Trinity River, dog playin' in the water, me sitting on my lounge chair, wine bottle by my side, and my guitar or fishin' gear in my hands. Works better than therapy. In fact, I can't do therapy anymore. My shrink is up on the Trinity tryin' to get some steelhead. :)

[JustStartin]

That set-up ya got there looks like you can get quite a variety of sounds. Not idiot proof enough for me though. :) I'd rather change sounds with stomp boxes. I don't like to make adjustments on my guitar while I'm playin'. I leave my pup switch in one place (neck) all the time, and the volume and tone are always up full. When I'm playin' at a blues jam I'll play clean for rhythm, then when my turn comes for a lead part I stomp on my OD pedal - which adds distortion and volume - then I wail away for once or twice around. Then I'm back to clean.

The wilderness thing. Hmmm, hard to say really. I've been doing that sort of thing most of my life. The time I spent in the Six Rivers area the time I made the axe handle was about five months. A business I had in '91 went under, and I loaded up my truck and tools and bought a tent and some camping gear and just got away from it all. Once a month I'd get a can of tobacco, sack of potatoes, bag of flour, bag of grapefruits, some gas, some dog food, stuff like that. Oh yeah, and a jug of wine.

When I get stressed out and need to meditate on a "happy place" I think of sitting on the banks of the Trinity River, dog playin' in the water, me sitting on my lounge chair, wine bottle by my side, and my guitar or fishin' gear in my hands. Works better than therapy. In fact, I can't do therapy anymore. My shrink is up on the Trinity tryin' to get some steelhead. :)
I hear ya. I'm at a point in life where I cant stand my work. I have no patience for the day to day stuff at all. I have visions of performing random acts of gross violence on buyers, and nitwit subcontractors. I tell myself only 12-15 more years of this shiz, and I'm done. Doesnt help. You know you're sick of work when you start buying lottery tickets. :mad:

I think you should hunt down that shrink, and pull a "Something about Bob" on him. That movie with Bill Murray and Richard Dreyfus, if you remember it. I went to shrink once, he told me I was schizophrenic. Then he lays a tab on me for $500. I gave him 250, and told him to get the rest from the other guy. :D (insert rimshot drummer)

Check out Deaf Eddie's wiring set ups. They're pretty clear and easy to follow. I dont know if they apply to a sustainiac, but check them out. Dkitt should definetely check out his Gibson set ups.
http://www.deaf-eddie.net/drawings/drawings.html

[Slipstream]

Yeah, I remember that movie. Saw it again just the other day. Bill Murray is a riot. Poor Richard Dreyfus at the end, eh?

Overheard at a party:

Doctor: Do you ever have people try to get free advice from you just because they know you?

Lawyer: Yes, it happens all the time.

Doctor: What do you do?

Lawyer: I give them the advice they're seeking, then send them a bill.

About a week later the doctor got a bill from the lawyer. :)




Oh yeah, I'll check out that link.

[JustStartin]

Just finished routing out for the pups and and wiring. You can click the pic for a bigger image.

http://img20.exs.cx/img20/7933/10001502ax.th.jpg (http://img20.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img20&image=10001502ax.jpg)http://img20.exs.cx/img20/3597/10001481sd.th.jpg (http://img20.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img20&image=10001481sd.jpg)http://img20.exs.cx/img20/6251/10001499rt.th.jpg (http://img20.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img20&image=10001499rt.jpg)

Pic 1) I took one of the templates I got from ebay and used it to cut the same pattern in my tele body template. I did that cuz I have center lines marked on the body template. Makes it easier to keep everything in line for the cuts.

Pic 2) Just shows using the template clamped to the body. I used the router and a top bearing pattern bit for the cuts.

Pic 3) The finished body.

All I need now is a long drill bit, so I can drill holes to connect the cavities for the wiring.

[dkitt]

Well I got my replacement center block on tues and finally made some progress. Behold! The resplendent photographic evidence:

http://img199.exs.cx/img199/9525/photo0015xk.jpg

I used the Just's method of routing a pocket in two stages for the neck pocket and neck pup cavity - going half way down on the first pass. That was a great tip! A router bit moves like a snail when its trying to plow through any more than a half inch of material.

On the bridge cavity, I used a 3/4" forstner bit with the depth stop nut on my drill press to remove as much material as possible before finishing with the router. This seems like the best/less tedious method, but the bit leaves the tiny holes you can see in the pic at the bottom of the cavity. Drats!

http://img199.exs.cx/img199/7249/photo0058rd.jpg

Here you can see what I did with the neck heel. I installed steel inserts in the maple to hold bolts instead of the usual screws used on Fenders - this wasn't easy. Got this idea from Malmsteen and Dan Erlewine, who recommends it in his books. Makes for a tighter and more secure connection.

http://img13.exs.cx/img13/7766/photo0127bn.jpg

This is a pic of the original acrylic template I used to adapt the traditional LP body shape. The body I'm making will have a slightly wider waist and a thicker horn as well.

The neck fits like a glove....ideally, everything on a guitar should just BARELY fit! :stylin:

[JustStartin]

SWEEEEEEEEETTT!!!! :eek:
Those cuts look clean and tight. What method did you use to pull it off? How did that lexan template work out? I shied away from them cuz of the melting rumors. Nice touch with the inserts in the neck. Where did you score those? I may want to go that route with mine.

Nice work man! Progress rules. Cant wait to see more. :D

Oh yeah, check out that deaf-eddie.net site, he has a boat load of Gibson wiring set ups. I think you'll dig it.

[Slipstream]

. . . All I need now is a long drill bit, so I can drill holes to connect the cavities for the wiring.Wouldn't it have been easier to route grooves in the body before glueing the top plate on? Gonna have to be kinda creative with the drilling it looks like.

I saved that link for reference. Handy drawings to have access to.


dkitt, what kinda wood is that. Looks cool. Nice precision work.

[dkitt]

[QUOTE=JustStartin]SWEEEEEEEEETTT!!!! :eek:
Those cuts look clean and tight. What method did you use to pull it off? How did that lexan template work out? I shied away from them cuz of the melting rumors. Nice touch with the inserts in the neck. Where did you score those? I may want to go that route with mine.

Well I melted the other tempate I had becuase I was using the shank of the bit instead of a proper bearing. That cost me the entire center block and so I had to order a new one. I got wise this time around and shelled out for a proper carbide one - although I couldn't find the size I wanted.

Some guy at my local guitar shop told me you can rough out the cavities with a chisel! Ha! :p I don't know what the hell he's talking about - you can't! You've got to have decent router AND a drill press.

I got the inserts from Home depot, but I'm not crazy about em. I caught myself making magical hand gestures in the air trying to make em fit properly! :rolleye: The thread is too wide, making them extremely difficult to screw in straight - and they have to be ABSOLUTELY straight. Wood screws are a lot more forgiving.

I'm saving your pics on my computer by the way - Strat heads look waaay better than Tele stocks. I'm making my own bucker-rings too, out of black lexan, but with a unique shape. More pics to follow. :}

[dkitt]

[QUOTE=Slipstream]Wouldn't it have been easier to route grooves in the body before glueing the top plate on? Gonna have to be kinda creative with the drilling it looks like.

Usually the hole is drilled right through both pup cavities FROM the neck pocket, but I'm going to try and find another solution - my installers bit is a little too wide.

dkitt, what kinda wood is that. Looks cool. Nice precision work.

There are over a hundred different varieties of mahogany. The ones used for electric guitars are usually from Central America, but mine comes from Peru. The South American stuff is sometimes used in classical guitars.

[JustStartin]

Wouldn't it have been easier to route grooves in the body before glueing the top plate on? Gonna have to be kinda creative with the drilling it looks like.

Absolutely, If I do another, and I will, I'll route wire chases in the body prior to glueing on the top. The drilling is no big deal. I've seen pics where they drill through the neck pocket, and through the two pickup cavities. Then angling down from the bridge pup to the control cavity is doable. I'll use a mahogany wood plug where I drilled through the neck mortise.

If I do another, the neck mortise, pickup cavities, and other routing will be done on the blank. The body shaping after all that has been done.

This is definetely a learning process. Developing your own techniques by doing. Thats why I like it. There is no rosetta stone to guitar building. Gotta cut your own path.

[Slipstream]

Yeah, my Dad used to say hind sight is 20/20 and foresight is 50/50. :)

[JustStartin]

Yeah, my Dad used to say hind sight is 20/20 and foresight is 50/50. :)

LOL! My old man says the same, but still refers to me as a toolbag. Regardless, he lives to hear about my, and others, wackjob projects. His boys are gone, or close to the end. He, my uncles, and a select group of neighbors planted this madness in me. Basically, all work, no screwball projects, makes Jack a miserable suicidal drone.

Hes coming down in May to check out the axe, and other neighborhood nonsense. He'll love it. :D

[JustStartin]

I'm saving your pics on my computer by the way - Strat heads look waaay better than Tele stocks. I'm making my own bucker-rings too, out of black lexan, but with a unique shape. More pics to follow. :}

I'm flattered. :o Just make sure you read my admitted bonehead procedures. :D Your pup routes and neck mortise looked killer. A router with jigs or templates is the best way to nail a sweet joint. What are going to use on the wings of that center piece you got worked? I know you probobly already laid it out,but this thread is getting huge, and my memory is shot from substance abuse in the 80's. :p

[Grim]

Glad I found this thread.

I too am in the starting phase of setting up the shop and getting started on building my own bodies and necks. I thought for sure that the neck would be too much of a hassle, but after reading the Hayscock book and the Bendetto book, I figure, what the hell, why not take a stab at it.

I've assembled one axe, using Warmoth parts, and it's my #1. LP body, 25.5" scale, SD's, and wired like a PRS with a 5-way Megaswitch.

I have three full size blanks, 2 1-piece purpleheart blanks, and 1 2-piece alder blank. I also have three tops - all bookmatched, one flame maple, 1 quilt maple, and 1 splted maple that might need to be a flying V.

I have the 9" band saw (I'd recommend a 14"), a drill press, router, routing table and a complete dremel set. Need a few more things to finish the job, but I'll get those one at a time (spoke shave!).

Rock on, fellas!

Grim

[Slipstream]

Hey, post some pics man! I dig lookin' at that kinda stuff. I think I can say that for the other guys too.

[Grim]

Hey, post some pics man! I dig lookin' at that kinda stuff. I think I can say that for the other guys too.

Absolutely. I need to grab the digital camera and snap some pics. I tell you what, I hope more of the guys on the board read this thread. I can tell you without a doubt that there is nothing more satisfying than playing your own axe. I got into this because I think I'm pretty good, and my skill is worthy of a goog LP, a good Gretsch, a Parker, a Godin, etc., but I just can't afford it. For the price of a good Paul, you can get started.

Band Saw - Ryobi, 9-inch, $80.00
Drill Press - Cummins Tools, 5 speed chinese job, <$75.00
Dremel Tool - (Merry Christmas, thanks Mom & Dad)
Rounter & Router Table - Dad bought 'em off of one of his mechanics, gave 'em to me (Thanks Dad)

The rest of it, clamps, digital micrometer, files I scavenged around for (gotta love Cummins - the stuff is cheap, but great for starting out).

It also doesn't hurt that my wife inherited about 700 board feet of walnut from the family farm, all milled and planked.

[dave frusciante]

keep the pics comin' :)

[dkitt]

sack of potatoes, bag of flour, bag of grapefruits,


God Slip, I wish I could live on that! I'd be close to being a millionaire by now - I have expensive tastes in food.

I had a client a few years back who used to be a Greek Orthodox monk for a few years. He swears that all the monks had to eat for a whole day was some oatmeal, three potatoes and a little bit of sauce...

Me: "Wait a minute...how much sauce???" :confuse:

[Slipstream]

You should know I'm a pretty sucessful trout fisherman. I did eat a lot of friggin patatoes though. I had a cool clay hinged thingy that was great for makin' biscuits in the coals of a fire. Oh yeah, and lots of coffee. I weigh about 30 lbs. more now than I did in those days. :)

[JustStartin]

Grim, pics are a must. We need pics. :D

I think I'm going to stain the quilt a burgundy red. I had ordered the pups with a pearl top, but the pearl will look like shiz with the burgundy. I wish he had gold. :( I may try the black pups with a gold ring.
I going to bind this bad boy. I dont know what color yet. Binding the drop top may be a nightmare. I may just paint a pseudo binding on it.

[Slipstream]

I'd hate to see a painted binding on there after all the work yer puttin' in it. Can't ya run a rabbitting router bit (with a roller bearing) around the edge? I think a triple black and white binding would be cool.

[JustStartin]

I'd hate to see a painted binding on there after all the work yer puttin' in it. Can't ya run a rabbitting router bit (with a roller bearing) around the edge? I think a triple black and white binding would be cool.

Using a rabbet bit on the droptop section wouldnt work. Rabbeting bits only work on 90 degree angles. Running a rabbet bit down the drop top section would be a disaster. The droptop section would have to be done with a straight bit, with the router resting on the 1 3/4" side of the guitar, and utililizing some sort of jig to guide the router along the same contour as the droptop. Its something thats real easy to botch up.

I hope that makes sense, but thats one way to get it done. You also have the hassle of bending the binding to conform to the drop top. Its something I'd have to experiment with before I gave it a run. From what I gather heating these binding materials to bend them lengthwise isnt a good idea either.

Honestly, I'll give it some more thought. But I'm in the "get it done" mode. Maybe not the best mode, but it beats "analysis paralysis" I see alot on luthier forums. On top of that, I missed my deadline. This thing was supposed to be done by TODAY, April 8th. Paul Sr.(American Chopper) is so disappointed with me right now. :(

[dkitt]

Grim, pics are a must. We need pics. :D

I think I'm going to stain the quilt a burgundy red. I had ordered the pups with a pearl top, but the pearl will look like shiz with the burgundy. I wish he had gold. :( I may try the black pups with a gold ring.
I going to bind this bad boy. I dont know what color yet. Binding the drop top may be a nightmare. I may just paint a pseudo binding on it.

Why don't you just tape around the edge of the top so it doesn't take any stain? That's what PRS does with its tops and its looks great. The lighter coloured edge running around the guitar almost looks like binding.

[Slipstream]

Using a rabbet bit on the droptop section wouldnt work. Rabbeting bits only work on 90 degree angles. Running a rabbet bit down the drop top section would be a disaster. The droptop section would have to be done with a straight bit, with the router resting on the 1 3/4" side of the guitar, and utililizing some sort of jig to guide the router along the same contour as the droptop. Its something thats real easy to botch up.

I hope that makes sense, but thats one way to get it done. You also have the hassle of bending the binding to conform to the drop top. Its something I'd have to experiment with before I gave it a run. From what I gather heating these binding materials to bend them lengthwise isnt a good idea either.

Honestly, I'll give it some more thought. But I'm in the "get it done" mode. Maybe not the best mode, but it beats "analysis paralysis" I see alot on luthier forums. On top of that, I missed my deadline. This thing was supposed to be done by TODAY, April 8th. Paul Sr.(American Chopper) is so disappointed with me right now. :(haha, I feel for ya Pauley! :)

I like dkitt's idea with the tape. That'll geterdone. I plan on having the same problem, except I'll have the advantage of learning from what you did. I'll make a deep rabbet before carvin' the top. Then I'll steam a strip of bloodwood for the body binding, and a strip of cedar for the neck. Maybe alternate the colors where the fret markers would go.

[Grim]

Why don't you just tape around the edge of the top so it doesn't take any stain? That's what PRS does with its tops and its looks great. The lighter coloured edge running around the guitar almost looks like binding.

That's the way my Warmoth Paul was done. I'll get some pics up as soon as I can figure out what the heck I did with my cable to my camera. :cool:

[JustStartin]

Why don't you just tape around the edge of the top so it doesn't take any stain? That's what PRS does with its tops and its looks great. The lighter coloured edge running around the guitar almost looks like binding.

Tape wont do it. Stain penetrates, it will bleed under the tape. Putting a coat of sealer around the edge wont do it either. The stain will bleed under that also. I have some pics on the camera of stain samples I did. It shows the bleed perfectly. Give me a sec and I'll dig them up.
These are pics I sent to my dad on the stains. I separated each section with tape and you can see what happens. Click the pics for bigger images, and you can see it clearly.

http://img146.exs.cx/img146/5506/10001539ja.th.jpg (http://img146.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img146&image=10001539ja.jpg)http://img54.exs.cx/img54/3968/10001544ml.th.jpg (http://img54.exs.cx/my.php?loc=img54&image=10001544ml.jpg)

Pic 1) Shows the bleed under the tape.
Pic 2) I put some sealer on the edge, then stained the wood. I got bleed under the sealer also. The pic doesnt show it, cuz I shot the edge with a thin coat of cream auto body paint.

Here is how you pull off the natural faux binding. If I was thinking a little more ahead, I would of stained the body prior to routing the radius edge on the guitar. The radius bit would of cut the stain portion away, leaving a faux natural binding. At worst you might have to do a little touch up sanding, but no big deal.

Lesson learned for me. DO THE RADIUS EDGE ON THE BODY AFTER THE BODY IS STAINED!!

[Grim]

First pic, my Warmoth LP. SD pickups, Megaswitch wired like a PRS.

http://www.piercingblue.com/thegrim.jpg

Here I'm prepping a piece of MFM. Note: I use a piece of rug padding underneath the guitar prior to making the outline to keep the guitar from moving around to much.

http://www.piercingblue.com/templateprep.jpg

Here's The Grim getting outlined. Nice flame maple top, eh?

http://www.piercingblue.com/makingtheoutline.jpg

After I made the outline in pencil, I went over it with a Japanese calligraphy pen so it's easier to see.

http://www.piercingblue.com/readyforthebandsaw.jpg

Hope I got the centerline right. I'll cut it on the bandsaw, then sand it with a drum attached to a drill press, then fine sand it with the Dremel.

[JustStartin]

First pic, my Warmoth LP. SD pickups, Megaswitch wired like a PRS.

http://www.piercingblue.com/thegrim.jpg

Here I'm prepping a piece of MFM. Note: I use a piece of rug padding underneath the guitar prior to making the outline to keep the guitar from moving around to much.

http://www.piercingblue.com/templateprep.jpg

Here's The Grim getting outlined. Nice flame maple top, eh?

http://www.piercingblue.com/makingtheoutline.jpg

After I made the outline in pencil, I went over it with a Japanese calligraphy pen so it's easier to see.

http://www.piercingblue.com/readyforthebandsaw.jpg

Hope I got the centerline right. I'll cut it on the bandsaw, then sand it with a drum attached to a drill press, then fine sand it with the Dremel.

NICE!!!!!
How do you like that Wilkenson tremelo? I'm thinking of one for a future project. Why do the finish sanding with a dremel? I'd stay with the drum sander. You can pick up a 2" drum kit with various diameters for around 15-16 bucks. You might want to look into a robo sander also. Has a guide wheel that follows the body template. I posted a pic of one earlier.

[Grim]

NICE!!!!!
How do you like that Wilkenson tremelo? I'm thinking of one for a future project. Why do the finish sanding with a dremel? I'd stay with the drum sander. You can pick up a 2" drum kit with various diameters for around 15-16 bucks. You might want to look into a robo sander also. Has a guide wheel that follows the body template. I posted a pic of one earlier.


I'm a Wilkey fan. I don't do alot of heavy dive bombs, or Stevie Stevens style trem abuse, so it's fine. I'll probably do 50% hardtails/50% trems. I Use the dremel because I just got it for Christmas and I haven't used it for anything yet. ;) . I have either the 2" drum or the 1 1/2" drum, and it came with a coarse and fine sand head. What I need to find is a spoke shave for the neck.

I'm pretty lucky - wife is supportive of my habit and my dad is an old machanic with alot of tools - many handed down from my grandfather and great grandfather. Gotta love those old Masons, they really did use their squares and compasses.

That, and having damn neart a thousand board feet of walnut from the wife's family farm in Iowa doesn't hurt either. Lots of necks in that woodpile.

[SG_74]

Wow, guys this thread is awsome. I've following it for awhile now.

I was thinking about it in the car today on the way back from the hospital, and remembered that my uncle is a professional carpenter. I asked my gran if he had any good wood and she said that he's got loads of bits. So it dawned on me, if I have access to this, then I might be able to venture into the fine art of geetar luthier. She said if my uncle did have the wood, then it would have to be cut before it got to me. So I said I would make a list of all the woods I would be interested in. My gran said he is most likely to have a LOT of Mahogony.


What are some good body woods?

Heres my list so far:


Mahogony
Basswood
Oak
Bloodwood(?)
Walnut(?)
Ash
Swamp ash


Now I know theres a LOT of hard work involved in this and i'm not expecting high standards and I am going to use a neck I already have.

With that in mind

I'm thinking about doing something like this:


http://www.geocities.com/no_reason04/cool_tele.gif


I was going to use a standard Tele for the template. I might cap the body but it depends on what I can find to cap it with. The body will be one-piece.

Now I figure that the routing is going to be the hardest bit. How do I go about routing the neck pocket, Hum-cavities and the bridge so that they all line up? (the routing is the bit i'm most scared about).



-< SG >-

[Slipstream]

All those woods are cool except the oak. I don't know this first-hand, but I've read that it's a tonal wasteland. I like mahogony a lot, but it will be hard to find a piece big enough to make a one-piece body (let me know if you can get some big enough!).

I think JustStartin showed the best routing info for the pups and neck pocket. He might be able to answer your questions about that better than I.

[SG_74]

All those woods are cool except the oak. I don't know this first-hand, but I've read that it's a tonal wasteland. I like mahogony a lot, but it will be hard to find a piece big enough to make a one-piece body (let me know if you can get some big enough!).

I think JustStartin showed the best routing info for the pups and neck pocket. He might be able to answer your questions about that better than I.


Ok, thanks slip. I was kinda leaning towards the mahogony, I just wanted to know if there was any really sweet woods out there worth looking into.

[Slipstream]

For a Tele type guitar most people would choose the swamp ash. The wood grows in water so the lower part of the tree yeilds an excellent tonewood that is very light, and has a high strength-to-weight ratio. I have never used it myself, but I really dig the tone of Gibsons (LP, SG, etc.) that are solid mahogony.

[SG_74]

For a Tele type guitar most people would choose the swamp ash. The wood grows in water so the lower part of the tree yeilds an excellent tonewood that is very light, and has a high strength-to-weight ratio. I have never used it myself, but I really dig the tone of Gibsons (LP, SG, etc.) that are solid mahogony.


Yea, if most people would choose swamp ash, then i'm going with mahogony (just to be a bit different). My SG is solid mahogony and that sounds lush.

[Grim]

Alder is good too. For practice, try Poplar. A decent tonewood, and very reasonably priced.

[SG_74]

Ok, I re-did the design with the woods that I will be using.


http://www.geocities.com/no_reason04/project_tele.gif


Mahogony for the body, i've decided against capping it since this is my first time and I will probably screw it up big time.

I am however thinking about very slightly arching the top of the body, but only subtly.

I would've loved to have had block inlays, but the neck I have has dots and I haven't the faintist clue about making or fitting inlays. Block inlays are therefore out of the bag.

[Slipstream]

Yea, if most people would choose swamp ash, then i'm going with mahogony (just to be a bit different). My SG is solid mahogony and that sounds lush.Yeah, that's what I'm talkin' about!

heh, I'll show ya different though. I'm usin' cedar for the body, bloodwood for the neck. The only time I've seen bloodwood on a guitar was on the binding. And I've never seen cedar used. I'll let ya know how it sounds whenever I get it done. Heck, I'll be postin' clips in the Showcase!

Oh yeah, if the wood is green (fresh cut) then you'll have to dry it. You have to be careful when you do that or it'll check (get cracks all in it). I've heard that putting wax on the ends helps prevent this, but I've never done it myself. You can check the moisture content with a meter. I forget offhand what the content should be, google it and see. I know longer drying times are better (if you can wait 80 years that would be ideal :) - but that's another story).

Alder is good too. For practice, try Poplar. A decent tonewood, and very reasonably priced.That's a good idea. Put them on yer list.

[SG_74]

Yeah, that's what I'm talkin' about!

heh, I'll show ya different though. I'm usin' cedar for the body, bloodwood for the neck. The only time I've seen bloodwood on a guitar was on the binding. And I've never seen cedar used. I'll let ya know how it sounds whenever I get it done. Heck, I'll be postin' clips in the Showcase!

Oh yeah, if the wood is green (fresh cut) then you'll have to dry it. You have to be careful when you do that or it'll check (get cracks all in it). I've heard that putting wax on the ends helps prevent this, but I've never done it myself. You can check the moisture content with a meter. I forget offhand what the content should be, google it and see. I know longer drying times are better (if you can wait 80 years that would be ideal :) - but that's another story).

That's a good idea. Put them on yer list.


Thanks man, I'm hoping that the wood will be dry, if not then I can get my uncle to give me some advice on it.

Bloodwood has always attracted my attention. Are you going to make the whole neck out of it or just the fretboard? Never heard of cedar but it sounds cool! Can't wait to see it!

Would it be practicle to make a body out of bloodwood? Or is it heavy like ebony?

I'll be sure to put poplar on the list. I can experiment with other body designs then :D

[Slipstream]

I'm going to buy an ebony fretboard from Luthier's Mercantile in Windsor, CA. I've bought from them before, they're cool people. They do their own wood drying, and fret slot cutting and radiusing. I'm going with a 12" radius I think.

The bloodwood will be for the neck from the headstock to past the bridge, what they call a 'deep-set' neck. The dense wood going from tuners to bridge will hopefully give me the ultimate in sustain. I like sustain. :)

And makin' a body outta bloodwood would be nice, but it's HEAVY! The board I have is about 1"x5"x5' and it's hard to pick up with one hand. It's got really tight, dense grain. It sure is some pretty stuff though. I'm afraid the guitar will be neck-heavy, but I'm willing to give it a go. :)

[SG_74]

I'm going to buy an ebony fretboard from Luthier's Mercantile in Windsor, CA. I've bought from them before, they're cool people. They do their own wood drying, and fret slot cutting and radiusing. I'm going with a 12" radius I think.

The bloodwood will be for the neck from the headstock to past the bridge, what they call a 'deep-set' neck. The dense wood going from tuners to bridge will hopefully give me the ultimate in sustain. I like sustain. :)

And makin' a body outta bloodwood would be nice, but it's HEAVY! The board I have is about 1"x5"x5' and it's hard to pick up with one hand. It's got really tight, dense grain. It sure is some pretty stuff though. I'm afraid the guitar will be neck-heavy, but I'm willing to give it a go. :)


Why don't you cap the body with bloodwood to even it out a bit? (OK it might start getting really heavy then lol)

So with deep set, do you have two wings that you'll glue on either side like the gibson thunderbird bass?

[Slipstream]

Why don't you cap the body with bloodwood to even it out a bit? (OK it might start getting really heavy then lol)

So with deep set, do you have two wings that you'll glue on either side like the gibson thunderbird bass?I like the idea of a contrasting color for the body/neck.

If it were a neck-through, then wings would be the answer, but the end of the neck will end about halfway between the bridge and the strap button at the end. A one piece body would be nice, with a notch cut for the neck like a regular set neck. I think I'll have trouble finding a piece of wood big enough to do that though. I'll probably end up with a two piece. At this point I'm pretty flexible though. If yer gran has a left-over piece of mahogany about 2"x16"x24" I'd be glad to use that. :)

[SG_74]

If yer gran has a left-over piece of mahogany about 2"x16"x24" I'd be glad to use that. :)


Trade ya for some bloodwood ;)


I see what you mean about contrasting colours, it would be a bit dull with the same wood. If you were going to paint it tho...

[Slipstream]

Trade ya for some bloodwood ;)


I see what you mean about contrasting colours, it would be a bit dull with the same wood. If you were going to paint it tho...PAINT!? Go wash yer mouth out with soap!

Trade? I could get more, but it ain't cheap. The board I got cost me about $40.

[SG_74]

PAINT!? Go wash yer mouth out with soap!

Haha lol. I'm planning on rubbing a burst into mine (if it goes to plan), but I plan to do it so that you can still see the grain thru the inner colour(s). I'm really digging the grain of mahogany. It's got a really "raw vibe" to it.


Trade? I could get more, but it ain't cheap. The board I got cost me about $40.

Hmn, well if I can get any extra Hog then i'll let ya know and we can sort out shipping if it's what you want. Don't worry bout the bloodwood, I don't really know what i'd use it for lol.

[Slipstream]

That sounds cool. Here's an idea ya might try - how about using a dye in some clear finish (varnish or that nitrocellular stuff). You could airbrush it around the edge in one color, then around again next to it with a different color, then a clear coat all around. Maybe a honey, amber, red (or brown) tri-burst? Well I guess that's something you could practice doing with the poplar.

[SG_74]

That sounds cool. Here's an idea ya might try - how about using a dye in some clear finish (varnish or that nitrocellular stuff). You could airbrush it around the edge in one color, then around again next to it with a different color, then a clear coat all around. Maybe a honey, amber, red (or brown) tri-burst? Well I guess that's something you could practice doing with the poplar.


Yea, the effect I was going for was somewhere along the lines of...

http://www.geocities.com/no_reason04/project_tele.gif

[Grim]

Always test your finish on scrap wood first!

[SG_74]

Always test your finish on scrap wood first!


Ofcourse, but wont different woods react differently to the dye/paint?

[Slipstream]

Ofcourse, but wont different woods react differently to the dye/paint?Yeah. Practice on the cheapest wood ya got for technique, then try it on a scrap piece of the same kinda wood yer gonna use to see how it's gonna look. The poplar is a lighter color so the results will be way different. If ya seal the wood, then finish it, and mess it up, then you can always sand it down. Best not to have to though.

[Grim]

Ofcourse, but wont different woods react differently to the dye/paint?

That's why you keep the stuff you trim off. All us amateur luthiers need a nice piece of trim every now and then. I prefer "now".

[Grim]

The template I started the other day... now finished. Roughed the outline with the band saw, then used the drum sander on the drill press to finish the job - one course, one fine. I am pleased with the template, wrote my name on it & dated it.

One of the things I'm going that might seem a little odd - rather than put serial numbers on mine, I'm going to name them. My first one is "The Grim", the black & brown Paul made from the Warmoth parts. For my first real one, I'll give her a nice name like "Eve in the Garden". I'll write the name on the template I used as well.

Cutting the template was fun. I might start working on a template for a modified double-cut Paul, perhaps with a more "horny" nature, like the Johnny A from Gibson, reminiscent of the old Kessel signature models.

http://player.gibson.com/dec03/images/johnnya.jpg

[Slipstream]

That's one hella good lookin' guitar! Bound to be more $$$$$ than I'll see for a long time.

Anyway, my guitar is the Alvarious #1 (and #2 is not likely :) ).

[JustStartin]

SG,
Thats a nice lookin tele. Nice touch with the tunematic bridge. Thats the only thing I dont like about tele's, those stock ashtray bridges. Since you're thinkin non trem, watch out for those mighty mite hipshot hardtails. I got one, its alright, but the plating on the saddles stinketh!

[JustStartin]

I'm currently facing two quandries.

1) What the heck color am I going to stain this this thing. I've made about 10 samples. 5 off the shelf, 5 mixes, and they all suck. I'm ready to bust out the rollers and latex if this shiz keeps up. I may stain it with porter(beer). I'm serious, the beer sucks. I put too much black patent malt in it. May as well put it to some use. Would make a good conversation piece also.

2) Pickup rings? What height. They have two height sets, but those are for tunematic bridges. I have 3/8 reveal from the body to the side of my neck. Can anybody give the reveal on a Gibson from the body to the top side of the neck? That would clarify it for me.

3) Yea, I know I said 2 quandries, but in reality three. Anywhere I can get gold sheet metal? My pups didnt come in gold. I need to make a thin plate for the top of the p-90 pups. I have copper roofing sheet coming out of my ears, but no one has gold. :confuse:

[Slipstream]

I'm currently facing two quandries.

1) What the heck color am I going to stain this this thing. I've made about 10 samples. 5 off the shelf, 5 mixes, and they all suck. I'm ready to bust out the rollers and latex if this shiz keeps up. I may stain it with porter(beer). I'm serious, the beer sucks. I put too much black patent malt in it. May as well put it to some use. Would make a good conversation piece also.

2) Pickup rings? What height. They have two height sets, but those are for tunematic bridges. I have 3/8 reveal from the body to the side of my neck. Can anybody give the reveal on a Gibson from the body to the top side of the neck? That would clarify it for me.

3) Yea, I know I said 2 quandries, but in reality three. Anywhere I can get gold sheet metal? My pups didnt come in gold. I need to make a thin plate for the top of the p-90 pups. I have copper roofing sheet coming out of my ears, but no one has gold. :confuse:1. How about some scarlet (red) Ritz die in some clear varnish?

2. I'm not sure I understand, but on my SG from the face of the body to the top face of the finger board is 5/32". The bottom of the finger board (which is the top of the neck) is flush with the rest of the body. So essentially this is the thickness of the finger board. That's at the edge - due to the radius, the center of the finger board is 7/32" off the face of the body.

3. Gold sheet metal is expensive. C.C. Silver and Gold has 14K sheets in 3" widths, a piece 1.250" x 3" x 0.008" with shipping is $76. I would consider Gold leaf (http://www.misterart.com/store/view/003/group_id/1514/Delta-Renaissance-Foil-Easy-Gold-Leafing-System.htm) instead.

[JustStartin]

Slip,
The stain thing is analysis paralysis on my part. :confuse: Your lowdown on the SG tells me all I need to know. You're Johnny on the spot as usual. :) The gold leaf looks interesting, but I'm past the research stage.
One thing that struck me is, we have gold kick plates on the base of the doors in our house. Wonder if SWMBO would notice one missing? :idea2:

[Slipstream]

Slip,
The stain thing is analysis paralysis on my part. :confuse: Your lowdown on the SG tells me all I need to know. You're Johnny on the spot as usual. :) The gold leaf looks interesting, but I'm past the research stage.
One thing that struck me is, we have gold kick plates on the base of the doors in our house. Wonder if SWMBO would notice one missing? :idea2:Gold kick plates? Gotta be brass man. If they are gold, you should probably replace 'em. :D

Well, since ya only had two quandries ;) , and I helped on one, looks like I'm battin' .500 - not bad eh?


Hey, why don't ya get the pups plated? Ask the nearest jeweler about it.

[SG_74]

Just, clean out yer PM box!

[JustStartin]

Screw it, I stained it. I took the burgundy red, and added some pee yellow amber wheat to it. I dont know what this color is but I like it. :D I should of added some more amber, but at this point, I'm too driven to pound this bad boy through the line for 6.
I learned something about quilts that could save yuse guys some scratch. I'll post it later when I have more time. Doing the faux binding wasnt a big deal either. Its alot easier than I thought. I posted routering the radius after staining. That may work, but scratch that comment, make me stand in the corner, facing the wall, wearing a pointed hat, counting to 1000.

http://img97.echo.cx/img97/3491/10001600ud.th.jpg (http://img97.echo.cx/my.php?image=10001600ud.jpg)

I got the binding so it is just a hair line of natural maple. I doubt the pic shows it, but it is sweet. Its just enough to outine the axe from the background.
I'll show something I figured about quilts, I just have to round up some pics to make it clear. I'll also show how I did the faux binding. Someone probobly already suggested how to do it. but I was more than likely to opinionated to accept it. :o

I put 2 coats of sealer on it tommorrow. I may try staining the mahogany with a light stain to deepen the grain some what.

[JustStartin]

Just, clean out yer PM box!

I did, and it was a brutal experience. :(

The messages all read something like this:

Dear Just,
You suck.............................

Dear Just,
Did your mother have any children that lived.......................

Dear Just,
Eat shiz and DIE!.............................

Dear Just,
I bet anyone that goes out with you, gets asked what they used for bait......................................

What did I do???? Well its on now!!!!! Any more commentary like that will be met with brutal return fire :_devil:

I got your PM SG. I"ll send you another when I get back.

[Slipstream]

I like the color. I can see the outline too. Let me guess about the quitl - some areas take the stain better than others, right?

[JustStartin]

I like the color. I can see the outline too. Let me guess about the quitl - some areas take the stain better than others, right?

Concerning the quilt. The quilt on my axe can be had all day on ebay for 25-27 bills including shipping. The problem with it is the grain is so heavy it detracts from the quilt. Its not the light pillow type you look for, with minimal grain lines.
One thing I noticed on my samples was that the darker stains camoflauged the heavy grain and let the quilt shine through. Lighter stains didnt do much at all to hide the heavy grain lines. Basically you can take a marginal quilt and and make it look AAAA with the right tint stain.
I cant post the pics of it. Cant figure it out. :confuse: I hope I'm making sense.

I paid 48 dollars for that quilt. They sent me the wrong one. Not the one I ordered. :mad: I dont know if you caught that thread, but they sent me a replacement of my choice from their website, and let me keep the one I had.
I'll post a pic of it next session. It makes the one on my tele look like a rag. I'm putting it on ice till I receive devine inspiration.

[Slipstream]

"ice", right on. So ya got two for $48? Better than if ya did it the other way and got one of the eBay ones.

[JustStartin]

"ice", right on. So ya got two for $48? Better than if ya did it the other way and got one of the eBay ones.

I came out good on that deal. If you're ever shopping for a quilt on ebay, you cant go wrong if the seller is Durawoods. I think their website is 3dhardwoods.com. I filed a beef with them, and they called me by phone to admit their error. Good people, easy to deal with. The surfacing on their material is sweet. The guy definetely keeps the blades sharp on his gear. None of that chip planing on their stuff.

[Slipstream]

good tip, thanks.

[dkitt]

Been off the board for the last few days upgrading my computer system. The hardrive was acting funny, and then when I tried to change the OS the whole thing crashed. Lost all my bookmarks and settings/passwords, but luckily had my files backed up - inc. over a thousand pics of guitars! :stylin:

Thought I'd post some more pics of the body just before it gets a final 80 grit shaping with the drum sander.
http://img181.echo.cx/img181/7784/p20ib.jpg

http://img181.echo.cx/img181/6397/p38gh.jpg

I almost lost it actually during the glueing process because I wasn't using any downward clamping pressure on the blocks. This is absolutely neccessary because as soon as you press them together the slipperyness of the glue makes them slide out of alignment. :eek:

[dkitt]

http://img97.echo.cx/img97/3491/10001600ud.th.jpg (http://img97.echo.cx/my.php?image=10001600ud.jpg)


Love it, love it, love it!:hands: :hands: :hands:
Good thing you went for a dark burgundy red - other reds can turn out pink on the dense areas!:brick:

[Grim]

Been off the board for the last few days upgrading my computer system. The hardrive was acting funny, and then when I tried to change the OS the whole thing crashed. Lost all my bookmarks and settings/passwords, but luckily had my files backed up - inc. over a thousand pics of guitars! :stylin:

Thought I'd post some more pics of the body just before it gets a final 80 grit shaping with the drum sander.

I almost lost it actually during the glueing process because I wasn't using any downward clamping pressure on the blocks. This is absolutely neccessary because as soon as you press them together the slipperyness of the glue makes them slide out of alignment. :eek:

Very nice. If I may ask, what kind of wood are you using? Looks like it's going to weigh a ton! Are you going to leave the edges sharp, use binding, or use a roundover rounter bit to add a curve to it?

Looks like it'll have tone for days, man.

[Slipstream]

Too bad nobody asked him that before the neck got glued on. :(

[dkitt]

Very nice. If I may ask, what kind of wood are you using? Looks like it's going to weigh a ton! Are you going to leave the edges sharp, use binding, or use a roundover rounter bit to add a curve to it?

Grim, That's South American mahogany. Its not quite as pretty as the best Honduran or African type, but it has about the same weight and tonal character. Its often used on classical guitar necks.

Its a hell of a lot heavier than my Tele I can tell you that...but then, my Tele's got to be one of the lightest guitar bodies in the world - you could use it as a frisbee!

I'm going to use a 3/8" round over bit on the edges and it will remained unadorned, in the great Japanese tradition. 'Wabi sabi' they call it - rustic elegance...refined simplicity!

But smooth baby, smooth...
Were talking 600 grit on the final sanding.:boggle:

[Grim]

Grim, That's South American mahogany. Its not quite as pretty as the best Honduran or African type, but it has about the same weight and tonal character. Its often used on classical guitar necks.

Its a hell of a lot heavier than my Tele I can tell you that...but then, my Tele's got to be one of the lightest guitar bodies in the world - you could use it as a frisbee!

Had to ask. I've seen a billet or two of decent maho on Ebay. I've got two purpleheart billets, and I'll be making brothers out of them. "Cain" and "Abel"...

I'm thinking about wat to do when faced with the heavier blanks. Do you put sound chambers in the back then put a bottom on it? Or better off putting the sound chambers on the front, then putting a cap n it? Before its all said and done, I'll probably try both.

[unclebobscircus]

Had to ask. I've seen a billet or two of decent maho on Ebay. I've got two purpleheart billets, and I'll be making brothers out of them. "Cain" and "Abel"...

I'm thinking about wat to do when faced with the heavier blanks. Do you put sound chambers in the back then put a bottom on it? Or better off putting the sound chambers on the front, then putting a cap n it? Before its all said and done, I'll probably try both.
LOL nice name

[Grim]

Where do you guys shop for tonewoods?

Beautiful stuff here, and better photos than what I can get off ebay...

http://www.gilmerwood.com/instrument_wood-solid_bodies.htm

I'll order a couple of bilets from them one day, but with a $100.00 minimum order, it may be a month or two.

Also, bought a Kunz concave spokeshave today. YEAH BUDDY! Tell me this doesn't look perfect for trimming up a neck.

I bought "A".
http://altura.speedera.net/ccimg.catalogcity.com/210000/212400/212464/Products/11370086.jpg

[Slipstream]

The place I go to is called Cooks Hardwoods. It's nearby, and they have an awesome selection. When I got my bloodwood the guy took me in the back to look around. He showed me a piece of mahogany that was huge, said it was worth $4,000!

I like that spokeshave. I looked it up and here's a link I found: Kunz Concave Spokeshave (http://www.tools-for-woodworking.com/browseproducts/Kunz-Concave-Spokeshave.HTML)

[Grim]

The place I go to is called Cooks Hardwoods. It's nearby, and they have an awesome selection. When I got my bloodwood the guy took me in the back to look around. He showed me a piece of mahogany that was huge, said it was worth $4,000!

I like that spokeshave. I looked it up and here's a link I found: Kunz Concave Spokeshave (http://www.tools-for-woodworking.com/browseproducts/Kunz-Concave-Spokeshave.HTML)

That radius on the spokeshave seems just about proper for roughing out a guitar neck, dontcha think? Get the curvature close, then start going over it by hand with a long piece of sandpaper, perhaps from a belt sander.

Yeah... need to spend some time in the garage this weekend.

[Slipstream]

Hey, I got an idea for making a sanding block with a radius - for either doing sanding on a fretboard, or on the back of the neck.

Cover something of the desired radius (like a piece of pipe or whatever) with some platic wrap (Saran Wrap - the clinging type). Then put some plastic body filler (Bondo) on it. You could lay in on thick and maybe put a piece of wood on it. Then when it sets you can pull it off and voila! Just trim and shape the edges a little. I would make it the same length as a piece of sandpaper. Then you could use spray adhesive to attach sheets of sandpaper to it and sand your radius. Wadda ya think?

[dkitt]

Hey, I got an idea for making a sanding block with a radius - for either doing sanding on a fretboard, or on the back of the neck.

Cover something of the desired radius (like a piece of pipe or whatever) with some platic wrap (Saran Wrap - the clinging type). Then put some plastic body filler (Bondo) on it. You could lay in on thick and maybe put a piece of wood on it. Then when it sets you can pull it off and voila! Just trim and shape the edges a little. I would make it the same length as a piece of sandpaper. Then you could use spray adhesive to attach sheets of sandpaper to it and sand your radius. Wadda ya think?


Slip, That would work for the fretboard because it has a fixed radius, but the back of a neck has a tapered radius to compensate for the narrowing width towards the nut. I think you can already buy fretboard radius sanding blocks at stewmac???

Now that I think of it, maybe it would work but you'd end up with a very shallow neck at the nut.

What I need to know is: How deep should I make the back control cavity on my LP body, which is 1.75" thick? In other words, how much wood should there be between the floor of the cavity and the top of the body for the shafts of the pots? :hmmm:

[Slipstream]

Slip, That would work for the fretboard because it has a fixed radius, but the back of a neck has a tapered radius to compensate for the narrowing width towards the nut. I think you can already buy fretboard radius sanding blocks at stewmac???

Now that I think of it, maybe it would work but you'd end up with a very shallow neck at the nut.

What I need to know is: How deep should I make the back control cavity on my LP body, which is 1.75" thick? In other words, how much wood should there be between the floor of the cavity and the top of the body for the shafts of the pots? :hmmm:I've seen the curved sanding blocks for sale (Luthiers Mercantile), but they seemed to cost more than they're worth. I don't know, maybe I'll order one. They're made of aluminum. Oh, now I remember. They didn't have 16" radius. As for sanding the back of the neck, it would be a where-you-apply-pressure kinda thing. Instead of bearing down evenly, just bear down more where it needs it. Working it in a twisting manner. I think it would be easier to do than to explain.

I can't help you with the pocket depth, I don't have an LP to measure, or I would. My SG's depth won't do you any good. If you can get someone to help ya that has an LP that'd be cool. If you have to estimate, measure the height of the parts that have to fit in there to see what you need, then subtract that from the body's thickness to see if you have enough. I hope you do, because I don't know what to do if ya don't. Good luck on that.

[dkitt]

Oh, I just found it on the warmoth site - its 1/4", so that means I have to drill down exactly 1.5" with a large forstner bit, about a quarter inch wider than the diameter of the pots.

Just finished putting the rounded edges on the body. :whstl:

[Slipstream]

Well that's right on. On mine I wanna do a 1/4" wood binding, then round it over. Probably round it over first, then cut it to 1/4" x 1/4", then glue it in.

[dkitt]

BTW, anybody know what kind of plastic Fender pickguards are made of? I'm having loads of trouble cutting the acrylic/plexiglass sheets I have - couldn't get lexan.
Acrylic is too soft to be shaped by sanding.

[Slipstream]

I found two types on their website. "Parchment" and vinyl. I've cut a bunch of plexiglass and used to have trouble with the edges melting. I tried all kinds of ways to cut it, and found the best was to score it where I wanted the cut to be, then snap it. If there's too much of a radius it'll break where ya don't want it to, so ya hafta do it in sections. Using any kind of power sander gives the same trouble with melting. It just gets too hot. Sanding by hand to dress the edges after you get it cut to shape is the only way to do it (that I know of).

You can make cuts that are well away from where the final cut will be, then another a little closer, etc. At the final cut line, maybe ya have about 1/4" of material to remove. I use a pair of pliers to nibble it away. Like with anything else, practice with some scrap.

[dkitt]

Vinyl huh? That makes sense - it would have to be very hard to take recording grooves. I wonder what parchment is. I'll go back to the plastic shop and see if they have vinyl. Acrylic is too much bloody work.:crack:

Thanks Slip!

[JustStartin]

I'm in the middle of putting sanding sealer on the axe. All I can say is, "Cans Suck!". I'm kicking myself now for not using the gun. I got the cans for convenience, cuz I didnt want the hassle of cleaning out the gun after spraying such a small amount. Seriously, I could do in two shots with a gun, what its gonna take 4-6 shots with the cans.

The lacquer I have in cans is going back. I'm gun shooting the lacquer coats.

dkitt, the axe looks sweet. Are you going natural with it?

If you guys are looking for luthier tools try Internationalluthiers.com
Their prices are a bit better than stewmac on tools. You'll just have to navigate through their catalog.

As far as body woods go, you need find something local if possible. shipping hurts on timber prices. I'm in the heart of furniture country, so hardwoods are pretty plentiful around here. My next axe will either be out of cypress or sycamore. I have the cypress, and I found a local mill that has some gorgous sycamore.

[Slipstream]

Internation Luthiers is a good site. I've been there before. They don't seem to have the spoke shaver though. They sure got a lot of other neat tools.

[dkitt]

Are you going natural with it?


I'm Mr.Natural.:batwing::litesbr:

[JustStartin]

Internation Luthiers is a good site. I've been there before. They don't seem to have the spoke shaver though. They sure got a lot of other neat tools.

There is another one, but I cant find it. :( He has the radius sanders, fret leveling tools, the works. Stewmac even sells some of his items he makes. I'll post it if I find it.

I should of put the sealer on with a brush. I would of been done 2 hours ago. One thing that was a pain, was the sealer made the stain bleed into my faux binding. I had to scuff the bleed out between coats. Its now ceased and all is well. Two more coats and I'm done with the sealer.

[Slipstream]

Yeah, I'm gonna use a brush. Let dry real well between coats and wet-sand with a block. I'll get some flat areas the first time, and bein' careful not to go into the stain, hit the shiny spots with steel wool to scuff it up some. More layers, more wet sanding, more steel wool, until the sanding produces flat all over with no shiny spots. Then sanding with progressively finer grades 'til I can polish and wax it.

Using a gun would be better, but I don't have one, or a place to use it. Cans suck. Ya never know when it's going to spit a glob on your work.

[JustStartin]

Yeah, I'm gonna use a brush. Let dry real well between coats and wet-sand with a block. I'll get some flat areas the first time, and bein' careful not to go into the stain, hit the shiny spots with steel wool to scuff it up some. More layers, more wet sanding, more steel wool, until the sanding produces flat all over with no shiny spots. Then sanding with progressively finer grades 'til I can polish and wax it.

Using a gun would be better, but I don't have one, or a place to use it. Cans suck. Ya never know when it's going to spit a glob on your work.

The quilt side, all I'm going to do is scuff it with superfine wool. I'm with ya on that. As thin as cans apply finish, I'd be doomed if I hit it with sand paper. I'm not even sanding between coats. I'm hitting it while its still tack. I'm going to let this thing set a good week, before I do the lacquer.

Definetely use a brush with your sealer. Especially with Red Cedar. That stuff is like a sponge with finishes. Another tip with Red Cedar. Put some tape on either side of your glue joints, and wipe it up immediately after clamping. Will save you a ton of sanding trying to get the glue stain out. Cedar is some thirsty stuff.

[Slipstream]

Yeah, I'll watch out for glue stains. Thanks for the tip.

[JustStartin]

Had my first disaster last night. After letting the sealer dry for a bit. I set the body on the workbench. I was moving some stuff around on the table, and knocked over a shadeless lamp I was using. Of course it had to fall right on the body. The sealer was surface dry, but not dry through out, or hard enough to take the blow. Here are the results. As always, you can click the pics for bigger images.

http://img154.echo.cx/img154/9198/10001714bf.th.jpg (http://img154.echo.cx/my.php?image=10001714bf.jpg)http://img110.echo.cx/img110/9025/10001722ph.th.jpg (http://img110.echo.cx/my.php?image=10001722ph.jpg)http://img110.echo.cx/img110/4555/10001733np.th.jpg (http://img110.echo.cx/my.php?image=10001733np.jpg)

Pic 1) The damage
Pic 2) The results of trying to sand out the damage.
Pic 3) Back to square 1

The sealer and stain sanded out quite easily. I was surprised. Took me about a 1/2 hr. I guess I got one of those two dye processes going now. :rolleye: I took a hit on the chin, but I'm not out. I'll restain it tonight and post the pic.

[Slipstream]

Bummer man. Good thing ya had sealer on it. Well, ya get to practice yer stainin' anyway. :)

[JustStartin]

Bummer man. Good thing ya had sealer on it. Well, ya get to practice yer stainin' anyway. :)

Thats one way to look at it. :D
I couldnt wait till tonight to stain it. I just did it. Came out nice. I'll have to compare it with the original staining pics to see any difference.

http://img33.echo.cx/img33/350/10001766bo.th.jpg (http://img33.echo.cx/my.php?image=10001766bo.jpg)

[Slipstream]

Cool, looks like nuthin' happened. Now go put yer lamp away! :)

[JustStartin]

Cool, looks like nuthin' happened. Now go put yer lamp away! :)

The lamp survived. If someone asked me what I'd do if something like that happened, I'd tell them I'd freak out and destroy the lamp. In actuality it was like watching someone run over your beloved pet. I watched it go down on the axe. Brutal.

After further rationalization, I didnt like the sealer anyway. :p It has a soft waxy feel to it. dkitt would find it unacceptable. Does not meet the hardness requirements. The lamp was the hand of the Guitar Gods saying, "LOSE IT!".

This was meant to happen, I'm better off because of it. :headbang:

[Slipstream]

That's cool. The stains I have already have sealer in 'em. I count on the final finish for the hardness.

[dkitt]

dkitt would find it unacceptable. Does not meet the hardness requirements.

You've got a great memory!

Sanding sealers contain zinc stearate which makes it easy to sand, but it also stays soft. Whats so great about the old nitrocelluose lacquers is that they were very thin and very hard.

I'm in the finishing stages as well...also bought some 500k mini volume and tone pots today!
Couldn't find the vinyl that Slip suggested so I'm going to use 3mm stained birch cutouts for my bucker rings and cover plate.

I have to restrain myself from rushing at this point, because I can't wait to hear what it sounds like!!!

"In terms of guitars, there was a lot of 'show' but very little 'go'. Whichever company uses grotesquely figured veneer tops and shiny thick paint is the one that got a lot of admirers at their booth. There are too many suits at this convention and not enough musicians...The smaller exhibitors got lost in all the confusion among the big companies who take up separate halls with live stages, furniture, breast implants, and other gimmicks...I picked up some expensive high end guitars but they all played terribly and had no tone to speak of." -Zachary at the NAMM Guitar Convention.

[JustStartin]

You've got a great memory!

Sanding sealers contain zinc stearate which makes it easy to sand, but it also stays soft. Whats so great about the old nitrocelluose lacquers is that they were very thin and very hard.

I'm in the finishing stages as well...also bought some 500k mini volume and tone pots today!
Couldn't find the vinyl that Slip suggested so I'm going to use 3mm stained birch cutouts for my bucker rings and cover plate.

I have to restrain myself from rushing at this point, because I can't wait to hear what it sounds like!!!

"In terms of guitars, there was a lot of 'show' but very little 'go'. Whichever company uses grotesquely figured veneer tops and shiny thick paint is the one that got a lot of admirers at their booth. There are too many suits at this convention and not enough musicians...The smaller exhibitors got lost in all the confusion among the big companies who take up separate halls with live stages, furniture, breast implants, and other gimmicks...I picked up some expensive high end guitars but they all played terribly and had no tone to speak of." -Zachary at the NAMM Guitar Convention.

Damn dkitt, You're gonna be done before me! :eek:
Where did you get your pots? Cant seem to find one place that has all I need.

I've read the entire Zachary site. Especially, " Whats up with Zach", and the "Guitars by the Devil" section. Hysterical stuff, and alot of truth kicked in for good measure. You gotta love a guy who flips off the big boys, rips Carlos Santana for waxing poetic about the spiritual experience of PRS, etc.
His sound promo filmed in a dive motel with a couple doing the horizontal bop next store also showed alot of class. I hope he makes it, and continues making guitars. More people like him are needed.

"Hello, my name is Zachary, and I make the greatest guitars in the world"

[dkitt]

Sorry, just couldn't wait any longer so I decided to sacrafice a set of strings and see what it sounds like acoustically. I still have a few things left to do, namely the electronics, putting the finish on the top and making the last bucker ring, but it just looked so good I had to play it.

As it turns out, routing the control cavity was THE most difficult part of the project so far. I really should have taken Zachary's advice and made a separate cavity or each control - one switch, one volume and two tone. What I've done is just barely passable (see pic2). I could have just bored two holes for each control and then joined them with small wire holes...instead of doing all this insanely complicted drilling and routing. I had to rout the cover plate recess without a guide! :eeksgn:

Notice how the hole nearest the bridge is wider than the others? Thats where the 3-way switch is going, so I can flip it with my pinky WHILE I'm playing. I measured that hole out very carefully.

I can't decide wheather to put the single volume pot behind or below the switch??? :hmmm:

I also have to decide what color to stain the birch bucker rings. Black? White? Chartreuse? I can't decide. I don't want em to leap out at ya, but I don't want them to blend in either???

So, how the hell does it sound? You know how Zachary talks about how a guitar should make 'a lot' of sound acoustically. I agree. If it doesn't sound good unplugged, theres nothing you can do about it - even the best pups won't help.

When I first put the strings on and stretched them out I thought it sounded weird, like a harpsichord.
However, that changed when I raised the saddles, adjusted them for intonation (they didn't need much tweaking) and loosened the truss rod a smidgen. Its only at this point that you find out if you placed the bridge at exactly the right spot!

It definitely sounds very different than my Tele. It has a louder middy sound. No twang here people.
It seems to have less sustain on high notes than my Tele, but I could listen to the low E and A all day. They sound fabulous. I'm searching for the right words...its got an earthy hollow sound to it.
I like it, but I'll reserve judgement until the wound strings lose that metallic clang they have when they're new. More later.

http://img257.echo.cx/img257/9629/2a8qg.jpg

http://img255.echo.cx/img255/8791/2b0rr.jpg

[JustStartin]

Lookin Good!!!!!
Nice routing on the control cavity. What are you going to use for a cover?

[dkitt]

Where did you get your pots? Cant seem to find one place that has all I need.


Just, Local guitar store. I'm using 500K mini pots. They're not functionally different from full sized pots but they take up less space, which is a lot more important than I thought. You want to remove at little wood as possible.

I'm also in a quandry about knobs.:confuse:
Chrome domes or Fender flying saucers?

[dkitt]

I've read the entire Zachary site. Especially, " Whats up with Zach", and the "Guitars by the Devil" section. Hysterical stuff, and alot of truth kicked in for good measure. You gotta love a guy who flips off the big boys, rips Carlos Santana for waxing poetic about the spiritual experience of PRS, etc.
His sound promo filmed in a dive motel with a couple doing the horizontal bop next store also showed alot of class. I hope he makes it, and continues making guitars.


I don't know if he makes guitars full time. I think he has a day job. He seems to like being on the outside looking in - gives him more freedom I guess.

Problably sell a lot more guitars if he just changed the headstock. They look a little castrated.

[SKEETER]

If you should decide to put binding on it (which would be a nice touch) there is a dremel tool fitting out there that cuts the inset for it. I think Stewmac has them.
I think mahogany is the ideal body wood for guitars, it resonates nice, and is dense without being outragiously heavy. You are using an LP neck? I would like to know how you work out the bridge position , and how far from where it would normally be it has to be to compensate for the different scale. That should be one interesting guitar.
SLIPSTREAM a novel idea just occurred to me for a headstock shape. I was thinking if I was going to cut a headstock, I would use a household object that has an oviously recognizable shape, then it occurred to me.. I have never seen a perfectly half round headstock end. I think I would take the lid off a peanut butter jar and make the headstock the end of the headstock a half of a perfect circle!

[SKEETER]

ALSO I don't know if someone else has addressed this, but if you are using Mahogany, you might look into doing a "grain fill". I redid the finish on a Yamaha SG series guitar, and grain filled the mahogany. Mahogany has a rather rough grain that even after sanding looks porous. Grain filling just fills the grain indentation giving it a smoother finish, and if you choose the right color of filler, it also makes the grain quite eye catching.

[dkitt]

ALSO I don't know if someone else has addressed this, but if you are using Mahogany, you might look into doing a "grain fill". I redid the finish on a Yamaha SG series guitar, and grain filled the mahogany. Mahogany has a rather rough grain that even after sanding looks porous. Grain filling just fills the grain indentation giving it a smoother finish, and if you choose the right color of filler, it also makes the grain quite eye catching.


I haven't finished the front yet Skeet, but on the back I used a Danish oil.
The grain is filled by wet sanding, and this is really only possible with oil or a oil/varnish mixture.

I brush the oil on the wood and then go over it with a sanding block wrapped in 400 grit sandpaper. The sanding creates a very fine wood dust which mixes with the oil and is forced into the wood pores. You then wipe off the excess. After doing this three times the pores are almost completely closed and you have a thin low lustre gloss on your guitar. :)

[dkitt]

If you should decide to put binding on it (which would be a nice touch) there is a dremel tool fitting out there that cuts the inset for it. I think Stewmac has them.
I think mahogany is the ideal body wood for guitars, it resonates nice, and is dense without being outragiously heavy. You are using an LP neck? I would like to know how you work out the bridge position , and how far from where it would normally be it has to be to compensate for the different scale.

I'm discovering that mahogany is different but not neccessarily better than my swamp ash Tele. I'm still getting used to the different sound.
Strangely enough, even though I'm using the same guage strings, they actually feel tighter on this shorter scale guitar - it supposed to be the other way around???

Seems to me that the bridge should be placed slightly further away than the math indicates. You're supposed to take the length from the nut to the middle of the 12th fret and then set the high E saddle at that distance from the 12th again. That's the theory anyway. I think it should go back 1/8" further, just to be safe.

[SKEETER]

Yeah, the 12th fret is supposed to be top dead center, but what I wondered is if the different in the bridge placement caused other things to have to be altered.
I think mahogany sustains a little nicer than alder or ash, although on a bolt on neck it may be negligable. I also think perhaps that mahogany has a little warmer tone.

[JustStartin]

Cans suck. I said I was going to use the gun but didnt. I didnt feel like taking the cans back. Anyway here are the results. With cans the coat is so thin it dries before the lacquer has a chance to flow. I hit it heavy, multiple thin coats while tack, so I wont sand through to the stain.
http://img246.echo.cx/img246/1346/10001946yw.th.jpg (http://img246.echo.cx/my.php?image=10001946yw.jpg)

The surface is still somewhat porous. I bagged the sealer, too waxy for my liking. Next up a light wet sanding with 600 grit, and another coat. As many as necessary till I like it.

[FrEtboaRDonFIRE]

That guitar's shure comin along nicely. It's real purty! :D Can I have it when you're done? Lol.

-=FoF=-

[SKEETER]

Just do a lot of coats, then wet sand it with 1000 grit .

[SKEETER]

Maple is nice if you are trying to get a nice bright tone out of a strat. Maple fretboards give a brighter tone than rosewood.

[Slipstream]

That guitar's shure comin along nicely. It's real purty! :D Can I have it when you're done? Lol.

-=FoF=-Yeah, what he said. :) :toohappy:

[dkitt]

http://img246.echo.cx/img246/1346/10001946yw.th.jpg (http://img246.echo.cx/my.php?image=10001946yw.jpg)
.
You got some good lighting for the pic this time around. Looks like tiger stripes...Gorgeous!:eek:

[Slipstream]

The lamp is in deep storage and he's using just the flash! :)

[b3n]

Yeah that looks awesome.

[SKEETER]

That is beautiful, is the top curved or is the effect of the tiger and the light making it look that way?

[JustStartin]

Thanks for the kind words fellas. :D

I gave it a wet sanding with 600 this evening, and shot another coat. The grain filled nicely. One more wet sanding and a finish coat, and I think this bad boy will be ready to assemble. I'm slowing down abit cuz I'm letting this lacquer get good and hard before sanding. Notice that I screwed up and forgot to tape off the neck pocket :rolleyes: More work, but sanding it out shouldnt be a big deal. I didnt shoot it as heavy this time around.
http://img251.echo.cx/img251/7153/10001973jq.th.jpg (http://img251.echo.cx/my.php?image=10001973jq.jpg)

The pups are to the left. Wish I could of gotten them in gold :( , but they should look nice with gold rings. Pots, rings and switch will be ordered this week.

[JustStartin]

That is beautiful, is the top curved or is the effect of the tiger and the light making it look that way?
No curved top. The stripes do give you that illusion though. I just put a slight drop top like a strat has. I was limited since my top is only 3/8" thick. I'll try an arched top down the road. To get away from the standard lingo, I'll refer to as a vaulted top. :p


Whoa, gotta go Deadwood is on! :D

[TheVaiApprentic]

all right heres a question from someone with no guitar building experience what-so-ever for all you pros out there.

My father and I are having trouble figuring out the neck. Everything about the neck, that is. (I.E. starting thickness, heel thickness, headstock attachment, carving the back, cutting to shape, routing the truss rod cavity, all that stuff and then some more.)

Help? :(

[dkitt]

all right heres a question from someone with no guitar building experience what-so-ever for all you pros out there.

My father and I are having trouble figuring out the neck. Everything about the neck, that is. (I.E. starting thickness, heel thickness, headstock attachment, carving the back, cutting to shape, routing the truss rod cavity, all that stuff and then some more.)

Help? :(


That's a whole bunch o questions! Check in at your local library and see if they have a book called Build your own electric guitar by Melvin Hiscock.

It gets into a lot of the technical stuff about neck building.

[JustStartin]

all right heres a question from someone with no guitar building experience what-so-ever for all you pros out there.

My father and I are having trouble figuring out the neck. Everything about the neck, that is. (I.E. starting thickness, heel thickness, headstock attachment, carving the back, cutting to shape, routing the truss rod cavity, all that stuff and then some more.)

Help? :(

Just my 2 cents, but for a first stab at building an axe, I'd buy a neck. Building a neck will take some practice. I'll probobly build a prototype or 2, or 3, or 4......., until I'm happy with what I end up with. Basically, doing a prototype(s) will help me develop the skills required to tackle, primarily, fret work.

I'd start with just building a body. That will get you acclaimated with using a router, and shaping wood. Plus you'll get quicker gratification by finishing your first project in a reasonable time frame.

You refered to the particapants in this thread as "pros".
:lolpnd: :lolpnd: :lolpnd: :lolpnd:

This thread started out with the "Three Stooges". Has developed into the "4 Marx Brother" and you can add any other slapstick comic who joins the fray.

No pros in this room. Its all learn as you go. :smile:

[JustStartin]

dkitt,
Since I have idle time on my hands watching lacquer dry, tell me if I have your neck prep right.

You sanded the back of your neck to 600, and then hand rubbed a verathane into it. Is this correct?
Have you already done this? If so how do you like it? Sounds like a winner to me, I may go that route. Sorry for not looking it up, but I want to see if you went another route, and your results.

[TheVaiApprentic]

That's a whole bunch o questions! Check in at your local library and see if they have a book called Build your own electric guitar by Melvin Hiscock.

It gets into a lot of the technical stuff about neck building.


I believe we have that book (he has it with him at work so I can't check the title). I haven't read the neck section to thoroughly (sp?) though, so maybe I should check that out.

I'd start with just building a body. That will get you acclaimated with using a router, and shaping wood. Plus you'll get quicker gratification by finishing your first project in a reasonable time frame.

Yeah, we've got the body building pretty down-pat, but then again were still just building the practice one (pine = super soft). It's just the neck thats giving us trouble. We've built about 3 or 4 attempts and are still working on it, but whenever we cut the back (were your palm would be) to a rough square shape, it looks way too thin, especially where it would connect to the body.

I just don't know. And we'd rather build our own neck, instead of buying one, but if we can't figure it out in a few weeks i'll suggest it to him.

[dkitt]

dkitt,
Since I have idle time on my hands watching lacquer dry, tell me if I have your neck prep right.

You sanded the back of your neck to 600, and then hand rubbed a verathane into it. Is this correct?
Have you already done this? If so how do you like it? Sounds like a winner to me, I may go that route. Sorry for not looking it up, but I want to see if you went another route, and your results.

Just, The neck I'm using was unfinished (thank you MightyMite!) and already pretty smooth when I bought it, but I gave it a thorough sanding with 400/600 grit anyway. I then took some varathane for floors (the hard stuff), thinned it down with about 25% varsol and rubbed it on - then rubbed it off with a dry cloth. The back of the neck is now virtually frictionless. :luv:

You have to watch it rubbing any solvent based finish over stain though. If the stain hasn't got enough binder it'll come right off. I would only use a floor varathane for a neck - anything else is too soft and will wear off too easily.

[dkitt]

You refered to the particapants in this thread as "pros".
:lolpnd: :lolpnd: :lolpnd: :lolpnd:

This thread started out with the "Three Stooges". Has developed into the "4 Marx Brother" and you can add any other slapstick comic who joins the fray.

No pros in this room. Its all learn as you go. :smile:

That's right! I made this guitar basically to learn WHY the wrong way is wrong - by doing it.

I'll tell you something, my guitar has just barely survived my general incompetance in just about every area.

It isn't even the same thickness all the way around! You'll see all the other horrors when I post the finished pics. Stay tuned!:stylin:

[SKEETER]

I clear guitars with water based urethane, far easier to work with, dries fast, and is a very hard finish. I work it like laquer once it dries.