Learning at the feet of a Master.......

[martinedwards]

Ok, tonight was my first night at Sam Irwin's Making stringed Instruments course at BIFE in Belfast.

There are about 15 people there, and what surprised me was that only two of us are new!! The others are at various stages of completion and it seems to be the done thing that when you finish one guitar, you just stay on and start the next one!!!

I was asked what I wanted to make.

"A Jumbo 6 string acoustic" said I

"Ok then" says Sam "have a look around and see what wood you like. Back & sides are usually Mahogany, Walnut or Rosewood, fronts are Cedar or Spruce".

I looked around and have decided on rosewood/spruce.

Sam then gave me the number of a luthier supples where I'll order the wood.

I spent the rest of the evening chatting with the other students. One guy was finishing off his #28!!!! a nice arch topped mandolin, and on the table he was gluing the back onto #29 which was a panhandle mando.

Among the others were a banjo, a bouzouki, a Les Paul with some AMAZING fingerboard inlay, a wide range of guitars ranging from just needing a bridge to one which was just a back with some bracing.

The other first timer had plans of a zither with him.

I said to one of the other students that if I ended up with a guitar worth the wood I'm going to buy I'd be happy. he said no, for a £300 outlay on wood, I'll get at least a £1000 guitar :D

looking forward to next week!!

will post pics when I've something to post pics of :p

[mishmannah]

Wow, sounds absolutely brilliant! Well, £93 a year isn't much for tuition, huh? :D :D

Tonally, Rosewood and spruce are the very best woods to go for...nice choice there, Martin!!




I have done a little research on fretboards, and it seems like a very good quality rosewood fretboard beats an Ebony one; they're tougher in the sense of long term durability for a start, and Ebony, although a harder and denser wood, can be prone to drying out and cracking after a while. Rosewood is the Duracell of fretboards, however not as fast as Ebony.

Yes, of course, I had forgot to tell you, that some of the guys stay and continue making guitars...that's why they all go down the pub and pull all their hand made guitars out!!

Ahh, find out if Jimmy Rainie is still there!!

And a bloke called Matthew (think he is one of the tutors)

Oh yeh, ask if they remember Rae Norton!!

Sam Irwin, huh? Well, thank him for the Avalon Silver range, he's made a poor gal like me a very happy guitarist!!!

[martinedwards]

my wood arrived in the post this morning.

left to right we have.......

a rosewood fingerboard.(theres a truss rod on the fingerboard too)
2 pieces of bookmatched cedar for a front
Rosewood back & sides
3 mahogany & 2 rosewood laminates for a neck (actually enough for two)
.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e328/gowanedwards/b1wood.jpg

I also got another truss rod and fingerboard for the les Paul build.

total outlay?

£230

[mishmannah]

Awesome, awesome, awesome!!

And the next episode is tonight!!

Martin, is the rosewood back n' sides solid?

[martinedwards]

Awesome, awesome, awesome!!
I heard you the first time
And the next episode is tonight!!
well, Tomorrow.....
Martin, is the rosewood back n' sides solid?

for £65, I'd B****y hope so!!!!!

[mishmannah]

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e328/gowanedwards/b1wood.jpg


Okay, nuvva question coming up..

What sorta wood will be used for the bracing? I have heard it on the grapvine that some luthiers are keen to get the best tone they can, and will endeavour for even the bracing to made of some quality stuff...

[martinedwards]

dunno, ask me after I've done that bit!!!

[martinedwards]

Okeydokey, update.

Tonight I planed the sdges of the front & back and glued them to make two solid boards. I also glued up the neck laminates and left them clamped. Sam took my front, back & sides to the Avalon factory, so when I see them next they'll be sanded down to 3mm thick and ready to cut into guitary sort of shapes.

Next week is a week off, so the story will continue then.......

BTW my neck lam is thisck enough to cut two necks out of. There is a kitty that we pay £1 a week into. this covers glue, fret wire etc. It also covers disasters like the guy in another class who set his neck ON FIRE when routing out the dovetail!!!!! He'll be getting the other half of my lam.

[mishmannah]

Okeydokey, update.
I also glued up the neck laminates and left them clamped.

5 layer, just like Lowden?

3mm thick

Wow, it's horrifying to think that the soundbox is THAT thin.... :eek:



BTW my neck lam is thisck enough to cut two necks out of. There is a kitty that we pay £1 a week into. this covers glue, fret wire etc. It also covers disasters like the guy in another class who set his neck ON FIRE when routing out the dovetail!!!!! He'll be getting the other half of my lam.

Aww, how kind.... :D

[martinedwards]

5 layer, just like Lowden?

yup

Wow, it's horrifying to think that the soundbox is THAT thin.... :eek:

well it has to be thin enough to vibrate

Aww, how kind.... :D

Not at all, as the Igors in diskworld would say.....

"what goeth around cometh around"

[mishmannah]

yup

Wow...a five layer lam is the hardest neck in the business...*drool*






Seeing as you are becoming [:p] Jam Session's Resident Nutter Luthierman [/:p], I can ask for your advice...

Have you ever been tempted to buy a Stewmac guitar kit? The woods are apparently solid, steam bent, routed, etc, etc,(EBONY FINGERBOARD), and the price of £240 seems V. reasonable, considering that one will probably end up with, God willing, a well crafted guitar that could be valued at £1000..


It's just that I am considering my options, as there are no guitar courses as the crow flies in my county....:(

Oh yes, and GAS is still very much a problem in my household.... :o

[Terren]

Not at all, as the Igors in diskworld would say.....

"what goeth around cometh around"

Would this be the same world that includes such crazy cats as Detritus, Nobby, Carrot, Vimes, and the like? If so, I used to read those books!

Back on topic, You are so fortunate to do this! I am going to now scour the locale area for lutheiring courses and hopefully I find something interesting.

Good choice for a top too. I've got a Canadian Cedar top on my Garrison and it sounds really good. It's a softer top though, but it has a very nice reddish tinge that shows through once you finish it. My sides and back are Canadian Birch though, which is a great combination, but I don't know how it'll sound with rosewood; which is why I'm gonna be glued to this post out of extreme curiousity. Good luck luthiering!

[martinedwards]

Yup terren, that's the ones, and aparently Pratchett has finally given permission for a film..... David Jason to star, but I can't think of him as ANY of the characters!!!!

as to the stewmac kits......

these folks certainly rate them (http://www.mimf.com/cgi-bin/WebX?14@48.hIpnaR9zrVt.3@.1dcf5aca/0)

its another forum... sorry to be unfaithful and all that.........

these guys (and gals) are all instrument makers and aren't at all condecending to newbies. I'd ask there first......

[mishmannah]

Great stuff, thanks Martin!

[paul_jam]

i thought i read david jason was being death, but i may be forgetting. apparently its going to be skyones most exspensive show ever or something? ive never read the books though, keep meaning too. should probably figure out what order they go in *hint hint*

and when can we expect more pics of the guitar? construction stages and what not :)

[martinedwards]

and when can we expect more pics of the guitar? construction stages and what not :)

When I've got something to photograph!!

[martinedwards]

OK, pics will follow on Monday cos the camera I took the pics with needs the cable I have in work and I'm at home and not in work til Monday.........

ANYway!!

Tonight I have what looks like a neck!!

Another Guy (Mike) is at the same stage as me, so we started with the block that I glued up last week for the Neck Laminate (M/R/M/R/M)

We used Sam's template to mark 2 neck outlines head to tail on the block then cut them out on the bandsaw.

Planed the top (fingerboard side) flat & perpendicular to the sides, then planed the front of the headstock to match. The grain on the rosewood lams in the neck are gonna look AWESOME!!!!!

Mar5ked out for the truss rod slot, but didn't have time tonight. I'll prolly do this in work with a vertical mill rather than a hand held router.

I have a pic of Sam holding a custom 12 string that he made which I'll post on monday too.

:)

[paul_jam]

did you bring him an apple too? lol jk

sounds like good progress is being made. wanting to see the rosewood grain your mentioning :)

and how much does it look like a neck? lol

[mishmannah]

Wow, looking forward to the photos...

[martinedwards]

OK then Knew Y'all couldn't wait, so.......

Here's where the headstock veneer will be stuck. the rosewood WILL be visible from the back though.......
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e328/gowanedwards/P2250008.jpg
this'll be shaped to form the headstock



Here is a side view of the neck. it'll be 21mm from the back of the fingerboard to the back of the neck at the 1st fret
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e328/gowanedwards/P2250009.jpg
the headstock itself has beed shaved down to 15mm, which after sanding & adding the inlaid face will be 16.5mm (ish!!!)


and a top view. Obviously there's a load of shaping to be done here to the headstock and neck, but if you look closely you might just make out where the truss rod slot will be cut. It's marked in pencil.....
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e328/gowanedwards/P2250010.jpg

the photos I took on Thurs PM I'll get on here on Monday....... Hopefully!!

[mishmannah]

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e328/gowanedwards/P2250008.jpg

OK then Knew Y'all couldn't wait, so.......


Hah, you know us all too well... :p
/\ Just look at that rosewood grain pattern, that's simply delicious...very Lowdenesque. Are the thicker pieces mahogany?


meanwhile...a Lowden neck, for all those unfamilliar with the famous neck design...

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y115/mishmannah/Lowden5pieceneck2.jpg T


The neck you are making will be nuclear bomb proof! :D

'Ere, Martin, here's another good guitar forum; some great lessons, but its got a Luthier's Corner too...

Acousticguitar.com (forums) (http://www.acousticguitar.com/ubbcgi/ultimatebb.cgi)

[martinedwards]

Yup, the other 3 pieces are Mahogany.

EVERYTHING made in Northern Ireland needs to be bomb proof.......

[Monclova]

:eek: Yup, the other 3 pieces are Mahogany.

EVERYTHING made in Northern Ireland needs to be bomb proof.......
:eek:

[DaisyRocker]

Mr. Edwards, apologies for the impending thread-jack but you said that somebody in your class was making a bouzouki; I was just wondering how the bowled back is accomplished? I know that very thin strips of wood are glued together over a domed mould - the quality of the instrument indicated by how many strips form the back - but I can't understand HOW, when you get into the 60-100 range with strips that taper to fractions of milimetres, such accuracy and neatness can be maintained. Obviously I realise that templates are used for cutting the strips but how is it all fitted together like that?

Sorry again but it's been bugging me for bally ages... :o

[martinedwards]

OK, pics from Thursday at last, if I remember I'll take t'other camera this week.........

Right, start with a block of wood made up of a series of laminates...
then use a template to draw on the side profile of two neck head to tail.
cut 'em out with a bandsaw
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e328/gowanedwards/B42necks.jpg

I also reglued the cedar top as it hadn't stuck right last time.......
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e328/gowanedwards/b3frontglued.jpg


After the top and front of the headstock were sanded the headstock was thicknessed to 15mm like this...... (Mike working on his neck)
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e328/gowanedwards/b5Thicknessingthehead.jpg


and finally we have the great man himself holding the 12 string he made for a guy called Barney..... aparently you can set your pint on the top as you play...........
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e328/gowanedwards/SamBarney.jpg

as for the bozouki, it's really a long neck flatbacked mandolin he's making, so no bowl shaped bits..... sorry!!

[mishmannah]

Wow.....S a m I r w i n....

What a normal looking chap he is!!

We're not worthy!!! We're not worthy!!!


http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y115/mishmannah/wayne2.jpg

That Twelve string must be THE most uncomfortable BOX SHAPED guitar to play in the world EDIT: just seen the left side of the guitar...HAHAAHAAAHAHAHAHA!!!!!...perhaps NOT

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y115/mishmannah/wierd.jpg however, imagine the BOOMY tone on that!! :toohappy:

Like to see him make a guitar in the shape of a Z... :p



Great pics, by the way...all that machinery is droolworthy, nice to see the cam clamps...

Why didn't the top stick? Not enough glue, or not enough pressure to butt the pieces together...assuming that's a two piece top.

[martinedwards]

Why didn't the top stick? Not enough glue, or not enough pressure to butt the pieces together...assuming that's a two piece top.
prolly not left long enough. last time we had about 55 minutes, this week I made sure it had over 2 hours.........

[paul_jam]

cool. its coming along nicely then :) any estimates on a completion date, though im equally as interested in seeing the progress of it also :) i spotted where the truss rod is going, but the neck is looking nice so far.

mish, you child lol :p

[mishmannah]

cool. its coming along nicely then :) any estimates on a completion date, though im equally as interested in seeing the progress of it also :) i spotted where the truss rod is going, but the neck is looking nice so far.

mish, you child lol :p

What? :confuse: :confuse: non comprende...

I was only impressed by Sam Irwins attention to detail...MArtin's pic of Sam's twelve string is a little dark at the bottom, so you think the guitar is totally box-shaped...the "B" shape enables you to play the guitar comfortably as it rests on your leg. I am astounded at the innovation.

I suppose you could make any shape acoustic if you handy with the steam bender, and a champion at kerfing...

[martinedwards]

Good progress last night, pics will follow.........

I'd already cut the trussrod slot in school on a vertical mill. SO much less scary than handholding a plunge router!!!!

Sam had brought back my top, back & sides from the sander in Avalon and they're lookin' good!!
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e328/gowanedwards/b6woodsanded.jpg

After practicing on a piece of waste wood I cut the circular slots for my mininalist rosette.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e328/gowanedwards/b7testforrosette.jpg
I got some black white black purfling off ebay

http://i2.ebayimg.com/02/i/06/54/bc/c7_1_b.JPG

which now rests in two subtle circles around where the soundhole will be.
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e328/gowanedwards/rosette.jpg

It's gone back with Sam for another pass through the sander

I also cut the dovetail onto the heel of the neck using Sams handy jig
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e328/gowanedwards/dovetail.jpg

[mishmannah]

Do you mind asking me why you are dovetailing, not bolting on, in the neck department? is it mainly because of the "traditionalist woodworker" element, or does it add more strength to the neck?

I am only asking, because I have read that neck resets on a dovetail neck (should the guitar become an heirloom) are more difficult due to manually unglueing and sanding the joints to re-align.

[martinedwards]

cos Sam says so!!!

The main reason is for accuracy of a join. Using the jigs he can gurantee a good postive join. with a bolt on mortice & tenon joint there's a lot more room for a loose fit.

A couple of the old hands are making bolt ons for a change, so it's not like the dovetail is compulsory or anything, just a good place to start

[martinedwards]

Tonight was slow, but I still got a bit done.

Slow as in waiting for glue to dry...... almost as much fun as watching paint dry........

Anyway, first thing was mark & cut out the body shape of the front & back
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e328/gowanedwards/P3090011.jpg

the minimalist rosette looks well after being through the drum sander.......
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e328/gowanedwards/P3090012.jpg
and if you look closely at the back you'll see a lovely wiggle in the grain either side of centre in the widest part of the "hips".......
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e328/gowanedwards/P3090016.jpg

Look, sorry about the hips comment, but c'mon, there's a narrow waist, so what do you call the wider bit beyond the waist as you travel away from the neck?

the shape that's cut out is rough, about 10 - 15 mm bigger than the actual final outline.

Sam had also sanded and slotted the fingerboard for me, so it was glued onto the top of the neck, but it's still in the clamps at the college.......

Where the waist was cut out, I used the off cuts to glue together to make a veneer for the headstock.

Pics next time.

Sam also had a lyre to show off. looked like the back door of a morris traveller (if you're not a brit over 40, do a google!!!) but the sound was so shimmery and sweet, absolutely awesome!!! I took a pic of Sam playing it with the other camera, I'll post it tomorrow night.......

[Sexymonkey]

Wow! That looks SO awesome! I wish I had a chance to build an acoustic, I think I'm too young though for somethin that money consuming though. I'm sure someday I'll attempt it thought. I bet your geetar' is going to turn out GREEEAT! You better post soundclips once your done!

[mishmannah]

Martin, that rosewood is fantastic; it's gonna have a lovely sheen to it once it has been varnished!! That squiggle will be such a unique feature of your guitar..

Love to see Sam's Lyre...

Sexymonkey...you WILL make your own guitar one day...:)

[martinedwards]

Yeah Sexymonkey, making a guitar, especially an electric,isnt that big a deal.

the neck isn't anywhere near as scary as people let on!!!

[Monclova]

Looks to be commming along so nice, keep posting these pics

[Terren]

I love this thread so much. MartinEdwards, I think I've said this before, but you are so damn lucky to be doing this. It's coming along really nicely, too!

On a personal note, based on your situation, I started looking for luthiery courses around where I live. Well, I found ONE, it's a school in Vancouver Island (The closest to where I live. And to THINK, I live in Southern Ontario, what a trip!). In any case, I wanted to build a custom electric, well made, based on a completely custom design. Unfortunately, the courses are about 4,000 dollars for 4 weeks to make a simple electric (boarding and woods included, food and guitar hardware isn't), or 8,000 for 2 weeks and actually put a lot of effort in it, including binding and possibly do ten-top or something similar on the guitar I want to build, as well as participate in some guitar repair workshops. Bloody expensive though, even for Canadian dollars! I think this would be a very nice sobatical to take in about 5 years' time, since I'm still in school and will have loads of tuition to pay off when I'm done. One day I'll do it though.

Until then, I'll live my dreams through you by continuing to follow this thread :D

[mishmannah]

I have finally found out that there are NO guitar building courses in the West Midlands..and there are no luthier businesses either...a HUGE gap in the market...

Terren, could I recommend to you something that I am currently saving up for, that would be a lot cheaper than an all out guitar course?

I am hopefully gonna buy a guitar kit from Stewmac...its a great way to get into Luthiery. Many people who have made kits get the confidence to design and make their geetars from scratch, as the experience of putting pieces of the guitar together at home enables you get to know the components of the guitar, and also even aid you in your original design.

I am also reading tons of stuff on the web with regards to design, and reading people's painful accounts of using the wrong glue, necks snapping, and the hurdles they have overcome. I am also investigating the different ways a guitar can be made: Some use power tools from beginning to end, others will boast and say that they used hand tools that were relatively inexpensive. Depends on how much time and patience you have got.

At the moment, I am practicing with inlays. I have some abalone pieces that I want to inlay into scrap wood. Then I will practice the art of sanding to a very fine finish and varnishing.

When I am ready to buy a kit, hopefully I will be knowledgable.


All I can say, when there's a will, there's a way!!! :D

[martinedwards]

I agree with Mish totally. If you gotta spend even $1000 spend it on tools you can use again!!!!

A ROUTER.... $60
CHISELS.....$40
A SPOKESHAVE $30
A PLANE......$40
A DESKTOP BANDSAW $600

Get a beater off ebay and pull it apart and rebuild it.

pull the frets and refret it.

(SO MUCH EASIER THAN YOU THINK!!!!!!!!!)

Cut a new scratchplate from a sheet an custom wire it.

All these things are amazingly simple if you can clear a space, do the research and go for it knowing that if you have a total disaster, it's only a $20 guitar, who cares!!!

I've very nearly done with my acoustic les Paul.

LOADS of good valuable experience and I've learned alot about neck construction..... like putting the trussrod nut at the body end next time!!!!!

I put the first coat of Danish oil on today and the grain has come up a treat, but I cant get it strung up til the saddle arrives from Tiawan anyway..........

I'll bung pics in the other thread when I've something to show.......

[martinedwards]

Tonight I glued the rosewood faceplate onto the headstock and then made a router jig to cover the fingerboard and headstock, stuck it on and routed it all round to give a sillouette.

the gap is for the nut...as if you didn't already know that!!!

it's not a perfectly symettrical headstock, but a little carving and we'll get there.
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e328/gowanedwards/P3160007.jpg
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e328/gowanedwards/P3160008.jpg
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e328/gowanedwards/P3160009.jpg

[mishmannah]

Is that a rosewood fretboard? I thought it was gonna be ebony??? :confuse:

The faceplate is wonderful: you can already see depth in the grain even without the varnish. Will you do any special inlays?

That headstock shape is just GREAT. Your own design? Looks like a play on the McIlroy headstock.... :)

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y115/mishmannah/weiss.jpg

The glueing is flawless, you cannot see any hobs or streaks.

Am I asking loads of questions? Am I???? :p



One more question.. :rolleye: .you don't happen to have the pic of Sam Irwin and his Shimmery Lyre on you?

[martinedwards]

Naw, fingerboard was always gonna be rosewood. It dawned on me last night that all my guitars have rosewood f/bs. I don't think I've ever owned a guitar with anything else.........

Played quite a few, but never owned.......

Inlays.......

I'm not a big fan of the fishscale vomit look, but I may........

Or may not........

we'll see!

Headstock design was rattling around in my head for a while, and last night with 15 mins to go Sam said "OK, headstock!!" I grabbed a bit of ply and folded a piece of paper in half. a stanley knife cut gave the shoulders and the wiggly top came as I was bandsawing it out of the ply!! Stuck it on the blank with double sided tape and then off to the table router........
If I remember to get my memory stick from the car I'll bring the pic home & photobucket it tonight.......

here y'go then......
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e328/gowanedwards/DSCI0024.jpg
Sam demoes then.......
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e328/gowanedwards/DSCI0023.jpg
Lets another guy have a go........

[mishmannah]

hahahhh, love ya Martin, thankyouverymuch!!!!!!! :D :toohappy: :toohappy: The only thing missing is a sound file....:p

I can see the awe on those guys faces...wow!!

Absolutely fantastic stuff.

There is another piece on the table...is that a top cover for the lyre or something? I have loadsa questions, about what type of wood he used, but I guess I'll do some internet research instead....


Hmmmm, there's another route I can take...lyres are easier to make than guitars, a great way to start...:)

[martinedwards]

No the thing behind Eric's Guitar body is a student lyre.

The Esteban ofthe lyre world..........

[mishmannah]

No the thing behind Eric's Guitar body is a student lyre.

The Esteban ofthe lyre world..........


Martin, do you think the Turner will take back seat when your "handmade" Jumbo is done?

[martinedwards]

OOOOOH tricky!!!!

Things are getting a bit out of hand round here with guitars at the minute.

Bear in mind that I have to fit all my guitars AND MY KIDS into this house, so, as it doesn't look like the kids will be moving out any time in the next ten years, I gotta do something else..........

I'll have to wait & see how the Les Paul & Jumbo turn out.

It would be really cool to have a jumbo, acoustic les paul, 12 string, strat, fretted & fretless basses and a mando, and all of them be home made.......

Ohhhhh now you've got me thinking about what my sig will look like in 3 or 4 years!!!!!!

The stock squier strat in my sig actually belongs to a former pastors son so I'll have to liberate that.

The guy who has the epiphone on permenant loan is getting out in June, so I don't know If it's coming home or not. I;'l prolly tell him to keep it, but let him contribute a set of strings or maybe a nice strap or something. I can't sell on anything until I have a replacement........

But, in answer to the original question (boy do I ramble!!!!???) the hope is that I'll have a guitar that is as good or better than the Turner. If I do, and it's reliable, then I suppose the turner will either go to someone who's learning or on ebay.....

[martinedwards]

Ok, tonight I attacked the neck blank with a spokeshave, chisel and 80 grit sandpaper.......
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e328/gowanedwards/40600025.jpg
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e328/gowanedwards/40600023.jpg
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e328/gowanedwards/40600026.jpg

still a wee bit of sanding to do, but it's coming nicely.........

[mishmannah]

Those diagonally grained rosewood stripes will look breathtaking when it's all finesanded, the mahogany grainfilled and varnished....

It's of the same high quality as the stuff that is made on the Acoustic Guitar Forum,I recommend you show off your luthier skills there as well!! :)

[JustStartin]

Nicely done Martin. She looks like she'll be a real beauty. Impressive to say the least.

[martinedwards]

Ok, a day late cos SWMBO was out last night & I was on childcare duty. Luckily, the college has a parallel friday afternoon course and as today was last day of term I was on a half day & able to go.......

When I arrived Sam said "what are you doing next?"

"Either bracing or bending"

"Ok, hot pipe or make a mould"

"DEFINITELY hot pipe".. theres a good chance I can make a hot pipe to make more guitars in future. A moulder will cost me £400.........

So, he rummaged in the scrap box and gave me a discarded mahogany side to practice on.

Pipe in vice, heat on.......

OK, for those who have never steam bent wood......

WEIRDSVILLE!!!!

I've worked with wood for 20 years and I know that if you try to bend wood, it breaks, simple fact of physics right?

Wrong.

I damped the wood with a cloth and held it on the hot pipe. Gentle downward perssure and suddenly it just "lets go" and curves!! Weirdest feeling!!

Anyway, I practiced with the mahogany and the first bend was, well, a bit 50p
http://www.tclayton.demon.co.uk/pics/dec/50/50bri.jpg
(Sorry needed a pic for all you non brits,.....)

the next bend was smoother, and the last was pretty good!!

Then I moved onto my rosewood sides, which Sam warned me would be easieer than the Mahogany.

I have an external shell mould for the body, which was what I was bending to. It took a fair while to get it sussed, but the wonderful smell of warm rosewood!!!!

I left the sides clamped in the mould to completely dry in the dehumidifier cupboard, so there are no pix (sorry!!)

No classes for two weeks for the easter hols.

[mishmannah]

Fantastic. DO you have a finish date, yet?

Yes, the aroma of Rosewood is a smell to behold. My Avalon reeks of it.

How is a hot pipe heated? I'm guessing it's heated electrically, like a steam iron.

BTW, SWMBO: Is it Swahili for summat?

[martinedwards]

No date, still a LOAD to do!!!

Sams Pipe is Electric. Cumpiano suggests a 3 inch scaffolders pole and a gas blow torch.......

SWMBO













She Who Must Be Obeyed.........

[martinedwards]

OK, troops it's been a while, but there was a break over Easter.....

And again, sorry no pix, but I'll get some when there's more worth posting......

Last night I started work on bracing the top. I cut all the housing joints between all those little bits of spruce and have them lined up, but the pentagon of top material that supports the soundhole needs glued in & the soundhole cut out before the bracing gets stuck in and shaped.

It has finally dawned on me that this won't be finished in time for the summer festival I was planning to debut it at.......

I'll need another term for the finishing alone, so I'll take either the 5 knob strat or the acoustic Les Paul to the festival.......

[mishmannah]

Last night I started work on bracing the top. I cut all the housing joints between all those little bits of spruce and have them lined up, but the pentagon of top material that supports the soundhole needs glued in & the soundhole cut out before the bracing gets stuck in and shaped.

Very cool...did you research and design your own bracing pattern, and have you gone for the AXE, AXX bracing or likewise (by the sounds of the pentagon shape I'm guessing...:p)

Mr. Lowden is a fussy man when it comes to bracing. He makes sure they are sanded to a "mirror-like" finish to prevent any problems with the tone...next time you see a Lowden, take a peek at the bracing and you'll know what I mean... :D

It has finally dawned on me that this won't be finished in time for the summer festival I was planning to debut it at.......

Yeah, the varnishing layers and buffing takes AGES, from what I have read...the curing alone would take you a little way past the summer!!

BTW, I would never take a brand new solid wood acoustic guitar to a festival. Especially in the summer...I couldn't BEAR thinking how all that condensed summer heat in a caraven/tent would affect the woods/glues!!!! :)


Ach, its a shame it won't be finished by then... :(

[martinedwards]

it's AXX so that a lefty could buy it for 000,s and switch the bridge : :p :

as for the humidity, I could always get aircon in the caravan :D

[mishmannah]

it's AXX so that a lefty could buy it for 000,s and switch the bridge : :p :

Heheh...I'd better start savin' then...Phew I'm glad its 000s, not 0000s :p

[martinedwards]

Mr. Lowden is a fussy man when it comes to bracing. He makes sure they are sanded to a "mirror-like" finish to prevent any problems with the tone...next time you see a Lowden, take a peek at the bracing and you'll know what I mean... :D

Got my paws on one on Sunday. AJ HAS moved on :( so we had a "new start" giving me a hand. She brought her dad's retirement present......

he's a Christian......

This is Northern Ireland.......

That'll be a Lowden then!!!!! :p

To be honest the bracing wasn't any different to my Turner......

then again, I've never had any complaints about it's tone either!!

Just it's HUGE volume :rolleye:

[martinedwards]

OK, last night I cut the soundhole (I stuck on the soundhole patch during the week).

then I glued the top bracing into place, and left it clamped over niht. Sam'll have taken the clamps off this morning, next wek I'll start profiling the braces.

[martinedwards]

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e328/gowanedwards/40600072.jpg
this still needed another two hour's work before Sam was satisfied that the braces were pretty enough!!!

Note the plane in the soundhole!!!!

I've now glued in the back braces and next week is the last class til september :( so hopefully I'll get them planed & sanded ready to hibernate for the summer.

[mishmannah]

Excellent. I was quietly hoping that you would give us an update...but I understood how busy you are with stuff...

I drooled at the sight of that AXX bracing. Of course, combined with the Jumbo shape, that is gonna be one LOUD guitar. I know that the edges of the bracing have to be virtually paper thin..do you have to carve down the "A" brace at the very top?

I am gonna stick with the flipped assymetrical bracing for my build. Perhaps next time...

Martin, does Sam watch the RH levels where the guitars y'all are making are stored? My shop runs between 40-60% RH...

I'm sorry that you have to hang on 'till September...in a way it proves that builds can progress at any speed. :)




PS: Does cedar smell nice? I walk into my kitchen, and the smell of Rosewood wafts throught the workshop...it's tortuous..I can't start 'till Wednesday the earliest!

[martinedwards]

I drooled at the sight of that AXX bracing. Of course, combined with the Jumbo shape, that is gonna be one LOUD guitar.
Ironic considdering that I made the Acoustic Les Paul cos my Turner is too loud.......
I know that the edges of the bracing have to be virtually paper thin..do you have to carve down the "A" brace at the very top?
nope, that's it done now.... heres a later pic after Sam said it was OK.....

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e328/gowanedwards/P6020002.jpg

does Sam watch the RH levels where the guitars y'all are making are stored? My shop runs between 40-60% RH...

well there's a drying/store room with a dehumidifier in there to help dry out the glue, but I've never seen anyone checking........

Does cedar smell nice? I walk into my kitchen, and the smell of Rosewood wafts throught the workshop...it's tortuous..I can't start 'till Wednesday the earliest!
My sense of smell isn't great, so to be honest I haven't really noticed, but I agree with the rosewood!!! Just wait till you start SANDING IT!!!!!!

[mishmannah]

On closer inspection that bracing looks very well sanded!!! A very neato job.

[mishmannah]

How's the course going?

I find it amusing that you managed to make at least SEVEN instruments outside the course since it commenced at the beginning of this year.... :p

[martinedwards]

Oh, right, this old thread!!!

well, things move slowly round Sam, and there's a whole batch of new starts to be mothered, so I've just managed to get the neck & tail blo9cks in and the top linings on.

I'm hoping to get the back linings on before next week so there'll be a CHANCE that i'll get the top or back in place soon.

[mishmannah]

Oh, right, this old thread!!!

well, things move slowly round Sam, and there's a whole batch of new starts to be mothered, so I've just managed to get the neck & tail blo9cks in and the top linings on.

I'm hoping to get the back linings on before next week so there'll be a CHANCE that i'll get the top or back in place soon.

Woah, too slow for you, by the looks of it...have you shown anyone that delicious walnut dread in the class yet?

'Never know, you could be running a class of that callibre yourself soon!!