Guitar Building as an Occupation

[Brendo613]

Hello, all. Crazy Brendan, yet again, with another question to busy your time with.
Just wondering if anyone out there is a guitar builder, or has any guitar-related profession, not just as a hobby. Looking at the reality of things, I realize that I haven't 1000 to 1 odds that I will make it to stardom, and I also realize that I have no plans of going to college, which makes things more difficult, money-wise.
I'm just wondering if anyone makes money by making custom guitars and then selling them, and/or if anyone thinks it's at all a possible career. I've seen little one-man shops, like this one guy in New Hampshire who fixed my camera for me, had a wonderful little shop with all these vintage camera's, and I would love to build guitars, maybe even have a little music store.
"You may say I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one."

Or so I hope. http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/unsure.gif

[Ukalali_Solo]

you know brendan, college is a really good idea, any reason why you dont have plans?

[Brendo613]

The way I see it it is too easy to get in on a simple football scholarship, or by some means that are not challenging the mind. Also, odd as it sounds, I do not like being around people, for the most part. A crowd at a rock concert? Of course. Entertaining bar crowds? I'd love it. Getting up first thing in the morning to become another sheep to be steered around by some droning professor?

I have a hard enough time focusing on things I don't want to, and to think that I'd make a profession out of that ...

So far, I've yet to meet someone (my age) who is willing to pursue a happy life at the expense of perhaps a stable career. I look at older friends ... my uncle Bob, for example. During the day, he is a postal worker. Hates the job, that's not the role model part, mind you http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/lol.gif. I love how he knows all these tunes, he is musically educated.

My uncle Joe is in a Beatles revival band, and the rhythym guitarist has a fantastic voice. When he plays, he is enjoying it ... enjoying life. For all I know, he could be a cocaine addict working in some cubicle during the week ... but music is the only field in which I could see myself making money, other than something related to engines, which I also enjoy ...

Always been a fan of cars and motorcycles. Own a dirtbike of my own, in fact, and I perform regular maintenance on my snow plow, a 1985 Cherokee. However, it's not a field where mental aptitude is appreciated. I may not be the smartest, but I'm wise. "Knowledge speaks, but wisdom listens." My all time favorite quote, from Jimi Hendrix. It sums up everything that I basically just said.

A thirst for more can always be filled by devoting time to learn more, resulting in happiness, so I hope. The funny part is that I would be completely content delivering packages for UPS part time, enjoying the smile on people's faces, driving a truck around, and coming home to make custom guitars. Every Friday night, I'd have a rockin' gig at some bar, and I'd ride my motorcycle regularly, enjoying a wonderful cabin in the woods with my dark-haired maiden ... That could be my life, and no f#ckin' college degree will ever fill that void I would be left with.

Understand now, Phil? It's more than a question about money. Truthfully, when I read all your posts about more equipment, I'm a little annoyed, but I can't blame you. I'm 15, I share similar feelings. Being 16, I suppose we're not all that different ... but I am happy with copies, deals from eBay, and a Crate amp through Radio Shack cords (the best I've found, actually). I don't need top-of-the-line humbuckers to create my own sound, or to play well. It's about inner happiness. A chi, if you will.

I think I should be a buddhist or something. Seriously, I should look into this.

Food for thought

[JimmyBlood]

Brendan,
I work as an amp technician. I repair and custom build tube amps, and buy and sell vintage gear as well, but right now working on amps is my job, and it's incredibly fun. That was such an insightful post! Man, you seem to really have a clearer idea of what you want to do than most people, certainly of your age. I am at the tail end of college right now, and like you I have a real problem with the whole environment there and being around people. Likewise, it is not a place about learning, everything I have learned while in college came from personal pursuits, including leaps and bounds in technical knowledge about amps, guitars, music, sound, and Zen ideas. Really funny that you should mention that. There's a book called Zen Guitar that really marries a lot of the ideas you were talking about, and I'd recommend it to anyone with even a passing interest in music and a desire to play from the right mindset.

Anyway, to answer your question, yes you can be a custom guitar maker as a profession. If you decide to try, start out with doing repairs and setups. With 5 bucks you can buy a ruler that measures 64ths, set of feeler guages, and a set of allen wrenches from your local hardware store (might even have some already working on engines like you do). That will give you the tools to set up guitars, and EVERY electric guitar will need a set up after purchase from a store, and again every seasonal change (summer to winter etc). Doing repairs can pay the bills as you build stuff. I'm just getting a handful of amps out there and the repairs pay for a place to live, food, bills, girlfriend, and tons of gear.

Definitely really think about whether or not college is for you, because it's not for everyone, and although it will have some benefits, you may be able to use your time more wisely. I could have had 4 years of electronics training at a trade school by now, but instead I will have a degree I will never use and have put up with years of useless agony and jumping through hoops for no reason only to do what I want to do anyway, and that is playing music and building/repairing amps.

Anyway, thanks for the insightful post, I really enjoyed it, and if you need any help getting started in repairs, let me know. I'm not a guitar builder (yet), but I do repairs on them too.

Oh, also, interesting that you say you don't like being around people like that. I am the same way! At shows I can play and sing in front of anyone anywhere, but in a classroom I am insanely introverted. It's hard to even go to classes, much less talk in them. I have to bring a guitar and hold it in order to give a speach or say anything there. Guess I'm not alone in that!

J.

[Fender65Mustang]

Brendo,
I'm going to say some things you may not want to hear and I hope you don't take them the wrong way. I am not trying to attack you or change your dream. I only want to help you understand some things about the "real world" you'll be making a living in. And I am basing my statements on what I have read in your posts about your quest for guitar parts for your Strat and Tele projects.

As long as you're working on your own stuff you can not care about quality and grab the cheapest crap you can find and stick in your guitars. However, keep that same attitude when doing work for others or making it to sell and you won't have a business very long.
There's a reason those pickups you scored on e-bay cost $39.00 and a set of Duncans or Emg cost in the hundreds. There's a reason some Sammicks cost $99.00 and some cost $250.00 $400.00 or more. It's not just cheap overseas labor either. It's also the quality of the parts involved. The wire that the pickps are wound with, the circuitry that the guitar is wired with, laminated vs. solid wood bodies, cheap pots, etc., etc.
An American Strat body with $39.00 P-90's and cheap pots might suit your needs but probably 90% of the people here replace the cheaper pickups that came on their guitars for better ones, not cheaper ones.

I don't doubt you would learn this in time. However, you have made the statement several times that "you don't care about quality", so you may not have time if you are planning a business that will live or die on your reputation for quality. Start out doing cheap work with crappy parts and no matter how good you get later your future may suffer from that poor beginning.

Now, no offense to the Zen attitudes expressed. I have no problem with how anybody wants to live their own lives. I am merely offering advice on dealing with the world in which we live. But, the truth is your 15. You don't know what you want yet. You know what you like now. 10 years from now or 20 you may not want a quiet little cabin. You may find that money is very important. You may want to live at the beach or buy a custom hot rod. And, music may always be a part of your life but you discover the need for other things as well , who knows?

I think most people would tell you that the "book learning" at college does little to prepare you. However, being "AT" college will prepare you in ways you can't even appreciate now. It will help you learn to interact and deal with people. It will help in areas like public speaking and organization and scheduling. It will help you in setting and meeting goals.
Not to mention how some business courses can help you learn how not to get in to leagal trouble when you want to build and sell your version of a Strat or Les Paul. And how not to get ripped off by suppliers.

I agree with JimmyBlood that college isn't for everybody, and maybe trade school is better for what you want to do with your life if you can find a good school that offers an education in wood working. But, NO education is a poor choice in my opinion.
There's so much to learn if you really want to make a living at it. You may get away with doing it once in a while for yourself, but if you want to make any kind of living that will pay rent and buy food you're going to need to know a lot. There are many state and local laws now a days governing the use of paints and chemicals, and there disposal. Rules about running a business out of your house. Things you are going to need to know bout storing your stock wood properly so it remains usable for musical instruments. And, even more laws on the safe storage of your paints and stains and such.
Setups are a good place to start like Jim said. However I don't think it would pay the rent for very long. Most people only pay for one or 2 before they realize how easy it is to learn and can do it themselves, and then your client base dwindles.

Again, about quality. You can't mass produce the bodies and necks like a Sammick or other company can. And you can't sell a hand made guitar for $100.00 and make enough to keep up with the rent. And you can't buy the bodies and necks any cheaper than that complete kit that Ukalali posted a link to the other day.
So how is it done? How can you ever make a living, even the modest of livings, building and repairing guitars?
Most independent builders do exactly what your uncle does. They work meaningless jobs that they hate so they can afford to do what they love. Then they (usually) have wives that work and pay the bills while they try to get their busines off the ground. Then, (and you'd be surprised at how often this happens) the wife quits her job and runs the business while the guy makes the product.

Now, all that being said. It is absolutely doable and NEVER give up on your dream. You can become a guitar builder. It's up to you how well and respected a guitar builder you become.
There's a guy online, I forget his name but it's almost the same scenario you described. He and his wife live on a farm, in Virginia I think. He makes acoustic guitars and if I remember correctly they sell for $2000.00 or $3000.00.
What I know about Zen and the inner happiness of Chi wouldn't fill a post-it note. But from what I've heard people say about it I've always felt it was a way of mind, not necessarily a particular lifstyle. Rather, dealing with life and the world from an attitude of inner peace no matter the situation. And experiencing the true "Zen" moments or inner happiness when you can. Like, when you're in the shop with a piece of wood, carving the neck or shaping, sanding, massaging the body and extending the life of that wood. Making possible, moments of happiness for others who will enjoy it.
Now, if only my personality didn't conflict with my philosophy. Oh well.
See ya

[Fender65Mustang]

"The way I see it it is too easy to get in on a simple football scholarship, or by some means that are not challenging the mind."

SO WHAT????? What does this have to do with you if that's not the way you choose to enter college? Enter on a musical scholarship if you want to be challenged and involved in something you love.
Blaming your dislike of college on the way other students choose to do it is, (pardon the very hippie like phrase), a cop out.
There's not conforming because you really follow a different drum, and there's making excuses by blaming others.
If you are going to have that chi you spoke of you're going to have to be honest with yourself.
See ya

[Brendo613]

That's the beauty of it. All these high-quality parts may not matter to me, but they sure as hell do to everyone else.

The friend who I bought these three Fenders from, he "engineered" his new guitars. Ordered the parts, and gave them to his guitar tech to make them disgustingly top-of-the-line. I would never get caught with a roller nut, locking tuners and all that. But many people would. Quality matters to me, just not brand-names. I believe there is a subtle difference, and "off-brand" and "low-quality" are too often associated with one another. Taking this mindset many people have, I would be able to make top-of-the-line instruments, custom built for people ... a bit like on American Chopper (GREAT analogy, I know :lmaohttp://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/smile.gif. They take the orders for everything on the bike, the kind of aura the bike will have, not just a color. It requires an artistic vision.

However, I did not take your post the wrong way, I actually appreciate your viewpoint as well. I wanted many other opinions before I was dead-set on my only job being guitar building. The reason I posted this is because I was curious if anyone actually makes money in the guitar building field. Tube amps, I suppose yes, because there are so many dangerous aspects about them ... I would certainly need a "real" job on the side, something part time. Alwayas considered being an electrician ... perhaps I, too, could build and repair amps with the know-how I could learn at a tech school.

I don't know, I think that tech school has a bad rep as being the "stupid people skool," but I certainly know that it is not. You need a sharp mind to assemble a piston engine just right ... (Good thinking about how I already have feeler gauges, shows you have a sharp mind).

It's ironic. Some of my best friends are honor roll students, A's in everything, but they have no common sense. They can recite dates and presidents, but whatever ... that will never mean anything to me. The way I see it, I will care in 20 years if I know the Dorian scale in all positions, even if I'm delivering packages during the day and building custom top-of-the-line guitars at night.

My point is that yes, I would like to be famous, to revive the hippy era through my vintage music (and I will not excuse the hippie phrase, I love hippie phrases http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/biggrin.gif), but it is unlikely to happen. I could be perfectly content delivering packages part time (keeps me in shape, and health plan benefits -- can't forget about those), building guitars on the side, or perhaps even being an electrician instead of a package driver.

People around me tend to wonder how I find so much good in most situations. Truthfully, it's all in the mindset, I don't go around looking for ways to be pissy (I already live with someone who does, and I'm not turning into that). While it may not be now, I don't think that money is the only thing I need. Even if I become famous, I will never pay someone to mow my lawn. I love mowing the lawn, for some reason. Probably because it's the engine that I tuned up, and because it's an engine. All about the simple joys, and if I could get some money while enjoying my simple pleasures in life, why, that would just be grand.

[Brendo613]

Also, thank you much for that post, Jimmy http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/color.gif. Although, I've never had a phobia of public speaking, I just feel uneasy standing in a crowd of kids from the suburbs with their Cadillac Escalade and $400,000 development home wearing Abercrappie, knowing that someone could be looking at me, saying/thinking, "look at that kid, with his long hair, open hawaiian shirt, beaten shorts, and no shoes ..."

Nothing to do about that but ... well, nothing. Unless I go on a mad killing spree or something I know I cannot escape those people, as no one else can, either. While college parties are fun, it's too big a price, both literally and in regards to being around class-A students and football people ... whatever. I prefer to be around musically inclined, and while I suppose I could POSSIBLY get in on a musical scholarship, I would not use my musicalness (heh) to help the college.

I just don't like being like everyone else, especially when I don't even want to go to college. It's not just about being different, for me, it's about what I want to do.

I still respect your opinion, and I do agree with the "real world" aspect about it. All I know is that I see a lot of my parents friends, musically inclined, day jobs to pay the rent and by the girl presents (electrician, postman, etc.), and they are happy people who do their OWN drywall work, they paint their own houses, and mow their own lawns. I will always do my own work, I just don't trust other people http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/biggrin.gif

-Brendan

[Brendo613]

One last thing before I wait for more replies. Being at college is not what I need to interact with people. I currently go to my High School in the suburbs, going into 10th grade. We don't have racism, but we still have discrimination. I don't have $100 clothing on, and I don't want to. The friends I have now are the friends I want for the rest of my life. I don't associate with people who I couldn't spend much time with, because I look for meaningful qualities and conversations in people ... a little off topic, granted, but High School has taught me that
There are too many asholes in this society
People will use you and screw you over
Real friends are hard to find, and once you find them, keep them close
Society is pressuring, and it's an extra element of stress that I can control, and I plan to.

From my experience's I've seen how people can be. I long for a hippie-like mentality, hell, even a little hippie colony, free of discrimination ...

For example, a friend of mine recently started telling people that she was bisexual. A big deal in High School, obvioulsy. She's been spat at before just for her sexuality ... if people can't understand how that is not a choice, it shows how disrecpectful, non-accepting and just plain ignorant people can be with their arragant attitudes, thinking that they are the only ones who are right, and everyone else is wrong.

Now I'm making myself angry thinking of how much I disapprove of the majority of kids my age, with the mentality that they are all better than everyone else. I see it everyday in classrooms and I hate it, I hate THEM as a result of it. I have no plans of spending more time with these people I LOATHE. I've taken Speech and Debate, we have all these public speaking lessons in English, as well. I know everything I want to know about people, and I have no fear of speaking in front of crowds, much less playing music.

I see no reason to become another "potential," as I refer to myself. I will not wind up in some business building with no plants and people who crank the air conditioning down to 68. In my room, I have 6 plants, 5 scented candles, and my windows are almost always open with the fan on. Air conditioning? Yeah, I have it. The vent is closed. Let nature flow through my screens.

My ex-girlfriend, now one of my best friends has a wonderful mentality like this. She is a bit of a free spirit, but a focused free spirit, if you will. She plans on college and always gets the best of grades, but she's sharp. Very admirable that she focuses herself on her work she's assigned, I really look up to her for that because she is not only a grade-A student, she also is a wonderful, mature young lady with whom I share countless memories and life theories.

Very off topic now, I know, but if there were more Elena's in this world, I would not have a problem going to college. This forum board is a group of people with whom I feel comfortable, knowing that we are all here for the same thing, guitars and music. However, while we may have conflicting lifestyles/life theories, in the long run, it doesn't matter because we all help each other whenever there is a new post.

Sometimes I wonder what is to come of my life, but for now, I have some wonderful plans to keep me happy.

-Brendan

[socialparasite]

I have to agree with you on the students driving hummers and other espensive vehicles. At my college The students make me sick and i cant wait until they get out and hit the real world and actually have to work. I have worked since i was 16 and hardly any of the students here have ever had a job. I pay for everything I have my new truck, rent, gear ect... I respect my stuff a lot too unlike the rich kids here who thinks it is cool to talk about being drunk last night and they make sure everyone knows that got drunk last night. Almost all of them are Hip hop rap listening fools. The average income according to a survey of the students parents is 100,000. I am a little older then these students so i do not try to make friends with them. I have met some cool pepole here but not to many considering there is about 50,000 students here. I agree college is not for everyone but i have also learned you are lucky to make enough to survive without an education or i have been told this anyway. I will hopefully be a teacher in VOC schools even though i could teach BIT classes in a regular classroom. I would rather work with kids that are considered "trouble" kids any day because i can relate to them (Hopefully also have lots of time to gig). I was an idiot in high school and never applied myself and i actually ended up dropping out my senoir year due to being strung out on drugs(i know its stupid). I went to a community college for 2 years and left with 3.9 and have maintained that here. I feel lucky to be here but at the same time i cant wait to get out and get away from these people.

[This message has been edited by socialparasite (edited August 02, 2004).]

[This message has been edited by socialparasite (edited August 02, 2004).]

[Brendo613]

It's always awesome to see others who understand my viewpoint. Amazing ... out of 50,000 people, only a handful are real friends ... granted, you may not have met all of them, but still ... just goes to show you the world we live in today.

I suppose I should've been born in the mid-fourties. Then I could've been in the 60's ...

Ahh, hell, I probably would've gotten a drug habit and died.

http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/lol.gif Just kidding, guys.

[TylerDurden]

I'm not gonna post an advice for anybody here, but i have to agree with fendermustang.

Im about to start the final year of my college this fall and i have to tell you, the last three years have been the best years of my life...

Change can be very hard and I understand why lot of people are scared of entering college, its a whole new environment, trust me, i know.... My family moved from india about 4 years ago, which meant that i had to choose an american univ instead of all the indian schools i applied to with my friends from high school. I was scared ****less when i first stepped in, just the sheer size of the school and number of people...all the tours i took (here and in india) couldn't prepare me for the fact that i was going to study at such a big place (big place= lots of people, 25,000 in this case) but after about a month or two i started meeting people who had common interests...
i entered the school as an undecided major leaning towards Business but i soon realized with the help of my friends (advisors don't do much) that my true passion lies in electrical and computer engineering...
the same people i met introduced me to guitar, I had never touched a guitar before...we taught eachother, jammed together in our free time...

in fact, with a semesters knowledge in Electrical engineering, me and my buddies midified a distortion pedal to give out infinite sustain (it didn't work all that great, granted, but it was lots fun)...by our third year, we were programming for devices, we now understand the basics of how an effects pedal works (for in depth information, i'll have to open it up...and i don't have the luxury of destroying it)...

a jam club was started last semester at our school and we were active in it...and one of my buddies informed me a week ago that we have about 500 signups from various orientations for the comming fall...
i think college experience is an essential part of who you become as a person (thats not to say that people who don't attend college are bad or anyting) more importantly i think it prepares you for the real world.

you can sit on your bed in your mom and dads home and think all about how mean and hard the world is but you won't find out the truth unless you venture out...and since your interest is guitars i suggest you read charvels (jackson) biography, it will inspire and caution you at the same time...

good luck with whatever path you choose.

[BluesMetal]

I am a firm believer in not scarificing your dreams or happieness for becomming what someone else wants you to be, we all need to live life as "we" as individuals feel we want our lives to be. I am a father of a 16 year old son and a 13 year old daughter and have had these conversations with both of them. An education is not needed to survive but you must consider the quality of life you want. If you will be happy living in some projects somewhere then scrap school all together and toss apps to all the local fast food places, if you want to live in a semi acceptible apt. building then go to trade school if you want to own a home and have your own work shop then decide what you would enjoy learning and goto a real school.
Money doesn't make happieness but man you need it to "live" if you have any dreams other then living hand to mouth you will want an education. Just having the few things you want in life plus paying the needed bills to get by is expensive enough.
As for building guitars, its a cool job if you can make it happen for yourself, I my self make my own bodies and use Carvin bolt on necks. Mostly works like this; I build one for myself and bang on it for awhile and someone will offer me something for it so I sell it and go back to banging on my Kramer untill I get the urge and get some wood I like and cut out another body. I won't call myself a builder since I just make the body but if I spend 300 to make it and someone gives me 500 to 1k for it I'm like "sure thing, want another?" hehe. I doubt I'd ever attempt to make a living off it for 2 reasons, 1, it takes along time to get a name someone will seek out for me to make them a guitar and 2, it would turn something I enjoy into something I have to do and I feel it would take some of the enjoyment out of it. And honestly I have never made one with the intent to sell it but when someone makes an offer I just see the money as a way to make the next one better or try a new tone wood. I am trying to teach myself to inlay for custom fret work.. thats where the big money is in small shop custom work.
But if I had never got an education where I can give my self and my family a nice quality of life I would not be able to afford to do many of my hobbies or the things that make me happy because nothing is free and to do anything costs something. As you consider your future consider what you really want in life and what it will take to get it, delivering UPS part time and selling a guitar every 2 months is going to allow you the ability to afford much. After your bills you'll be lucky to be able to buy parts for your next project. And thats long before you can even think of buying that cabin you want. You will never get a loan to buy a house or land if your not making good money to back it up.
And seriously you must consider what people want in a guitar, I personally hate trems and always do my strings through the body so I get more of the woods tone into my music, but if I was building one with a trem I would go with a floyd rose over a copy because that is something a person wanting that style of trem would look for. You have to build something someone would want to spend thier hard earned money on if you plan on making any. Thats why I just build mine for me but I have no dream of making a living at it.

[Brendo613]

Uh ... I have no plans of sitting in my mom and dad's house thinking of how mean the world is. I'm just saying what I'd like to be doing, and clearly, few people agree that I can make it all right by choosing my own profession. I know I'll need some education for a job, and I'll probably wind up going to tech school. College doesn't interest me, and I didn't post this so that people could come on and tell me that I need an education to make it, because I already know that. That's why I have it as a question, to see if anybody does this as a profession.

I know that I'd have to build them to the buyers needs, that's the whole point! I am fine with budget parts, but most people who would order a custom guitar don't want Mighty Mite P-90's, they want top-of-the-line string through body type guitars, which is where the money lies. I realize it would likely be a side hobby, and I've seen many people who have jobs in which they were trained and they then work a side job, like guitar building, in my case, as a hobby.

Anyway, I think I heard what was expected, that it is not exactly possible to live off of making guitars, and I appreciate all the replies.

I'll look into jobs where an education is needed, but not college. I already hate school, and I'm surprised that few people understand ... anyway, thank you for the replies.

[Brendo613]

Talked to my mom for a little (I am 15, you know http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/wink.gif), and she says how times have changed, and college is now the new high school, meaning how it's basically a requirement. I suppose most of you are right in regards to how I need an education ... which is why I will ask this. What are your jobs? I may not be content driving a package car, but driving UPS DOES make a lot of money. Know how I know? My dad drives UPS, tractor trailer from Philly --> Syracuse, 4 nights a week. Granted, it's from 6:00 pm to 6:00 in the morning, but he still makes $80,000 a year, and supports a family of four with many mortgages for our growing house (ALWAYS under construction), and two cars. He is a crazy workaholic, though, but I have no plans of a family (yet, at least), and I think that I could easily support myself driving a package car, but it would have to be full time if I want a house, which I do. Already don't like being around people, and now I'd have to be around people while keeping my amp at reasonable volumes?! WHAT?! http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/lol.gif

I apologize for previous post, acted out a little bit based on emotion. The more I think of it, I realize that I do need an education, and, not to sound conceded, but I can't put a bright mind to waste. I don't mean that in an egotistical way, just in regards to how I do have potential, and while I'd love to have a musical career, I doubt I could START OFF without a sufficient background.

I thank you for the down-to-earth posts, I actually did need to hear that. But what are my options now? My mom suggested a local college, in which I could take the basic college requirements (math, science, probably some philosphy, etc.) and perhaps some for fun. I've been there before, and they have an automotive course ... but again, I'd be stuck with mouthbreathers, not musical enthusiasts. Perhaps I could become an electrician, repairing tube amps and building guitars on the side? Just dreaming here, but not exactly dreaming anymore ... I am now looking for a realistic job that could bring in money, and still allow time on the side for hobbies.

-Brendan

[Brendo613]

Jimmy, what is your life like? Marital status, family, house / apt, etc. I want to know it all http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/color.gif

[Ukalali_Solo]

Hey brendo about you "being annoyed" when i ask about new gear, i only ask to see what other people think about those things. I havent gotten about 90% percent of the stuff theyve asked about, and i work for all teh stuff i do buy, i spent hours working at a pissy job for 3 months for my amp, i had to sell my first guitar which i loved just to get a new one, and well, my parents dont like me spending money alot on guitar so its extremely hard for them to let me buy my stuff. I wish i had the gear u have right now, i want a les paul, but im not even willing to spend 500 on an epi LP, so ill probably end up making my own, or even a samick like yours, i wouldnt spend 1500 on a gibson classic even if i had the money, id save it or only use a giant fraction of it to buy a copy.

just clearing stuff up
-phil

[Brendo613]

Awesome, Phil. Thanks for clearing that up, I see you in a whole new light now. Where do you work, just out of curiosity? I turned down a job at the gas station for ... well, obvious reasons. I wouldn't even be around engines, just pumping gas ... literally, and working the cash register.

Great to hear you spend so much time tinkerin' with your gear, I do the same http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/biggrin.gif

Rock on.

-Brendan http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/movingeyes.gif

[Ukalali_Solo]

i actually work two jobs (one is just for the summer tho):

i work at this tutoring place called Kumon, i grade papers and ****, you havent seen boring until u spend 15 hours a week or more there, but i had to make a sacrifice for my tube amp regardless if its one of the lowest class tube amps, i could care less, i love it and thats what counts, and i dont buy used anymore because of bad experiences.

I also take care of these kids 4 times a week for 9 hours everytime, it makes ends meet for saving for a car (i dunno when ill get one, but lets hope in a year), girlfriend, and just my hobbies.

I too have a problem hanging out with the "popular crowd", i was friends with alot of them when i was younger (middle, elementary) but we changed, and they are the car driving pot smoking (only for popularity, which i dont approve) hip hoppers. So i found friends who i feel comfortable with, the smarter outcasts who spend their time playing nintendo and talking about music, hell i made a band with them, and i dont want to play in gigs at peoples parties, i wanna play in my garage and then go dick around.

While im not wealthy, i live a very very comfortable life, my dad came here from colombia with only 300 dollars in his pocket and a scholarship to colorado state, and he worked his f***ing a$$ off to get where he is today, and to give me and the rest of my family a very comfortable life. I could be one of those aberpoopy kids if i really wanted to, but i dont, id much rather wear my beatles shirt any jeans and my vans any day over that. My parents unfortunately dont understand my addiction to the guitar, they love that i play it, but they dont let me go out and buy a new guitar because i want a shred guitar, hell everytime i go to guitarcenter for something it takes hours of begging before for them to let me spend my worked money on a pedal or sumthin.

I too really want to learn to build guitars, i figure id rather have my time spent, time thought, MY axe, rather than some overseas built piece of 2x4 with a name scribbled on the neck. The entire reason for wanting to make that kit was to learn the trade of guitar and eventually lead to buying every piece and doing it from my head, not instructions.

But about college, im not going to brag, but i am smart, and i work hard, because i want to lead a comfortable life when i grow up. Going to college is something i kno i will do, and i kno its not for everyone, but its always good to have a degree to fall back on. My entire life i have wanted to grow up to be an animator, i love cartoons, and i draw as much as i play with my axe (alot of time), but its a hard business, so thats why itll be a second job or hobby. I think atleast take some community college courses or sumthin, and dont rule out college yet, you still have many years to decide, and there are infinite careers available, you seem to like working with your hands, as do i (i build gundam models and draw and love to build little stuff), so i think electronics may be a great way for you to go, but its all up to you.


anyways mate, we actually sound to be very similar people, i too wish the hippy days could be rejuvenated, and i dont deal well with normal people, and hey this is also a little funny your ex girlfriends name is my girlfriends name in english (Helen) lol

anyways, if u do become a guitar builder, id love to be your first customer, formost because ur about the love put into the guitar, not the schaller locking tuners and 2000 brazilian wood, its about the time and energy put in to make it the best u can

peace
-phil

[socialparasite]

Brendo613, I would also like to make another suggestion to you. I would say go ahead and try what you want to do. If it does not work out for then you can always go and get a degree or something to that nature later in life. I think it is terriable to be pressured to pick a field one is unsure of. Honestly i think it is best for people getting out of high school to get a job and work different jobs to get a hands on feel of different fields. Some people already know what they want to do 100% and some dont. Most of the people that dont are pushed by family to graduate college. A few years down the road those people come back and major in something else cause they hated there jobs. I think quality of life is more important then money but that is just me. I will never be rich as a teacher but i wont be dirt poor either. I will set back play guitar and enjoy my weekends,holidays, and summers off while other people are out there to make an extra dollar. I guess my point is if it makes you happy and you can make a decent living then go for it!!!!

[Brendo613]

Phil, I am extremely honored for you to be first in line with my nonexistant guitar business. That does mean a lot to me, and I hope to get into it over the next few years. Hopefully we will keep in touch!

"I think quality of life is more important then money but that is just me. " That's a fantastic quote! Basically sums up I've been trying to say through my gross generalization that college sucks out the quality of life. That's just a general observation, and I've come to realize that Fender and everyone else, you are right, I do need an education and a degree to fall back on.

This friend of my dad's (also of mine, I know, a million musician friends and whatnot) is a fantastic guitar player, Tom. He's played for 30+ years, and just talked to him for about 20 minutes on the phone today, wanted to know whether or not to use 250k or 500k pots. Before you paint a picture of him in your mind, just know that he is an ash hole, and is very opinionated and not very courteous. However, he is unmarried (I plan to find a special someone ... again), no kids, and lives on his own. I can't wait to go and see his guitar collection, though I hear he lives like an absolute swine. ANYWAY, he was telling me how he went to college and dropped out within 2 months because he realized that there were two years of math and physics, which had nothing to do with what he wanted, and then, in junior year, things got interesting. He went to a local community college (I might do this, there is one RIGHT near me, less than 1/2 mile! DeVry ...) for a little, and then, to avoid the draft, went into the Navy ... got an education with electronics there, and is now an electrical technician or something, and he worked on countless tube amps and repairing instruments for everyone, just like I want to do, and he has lots of free time and I suppose plenty of money to keep himself occupied. He even build a Telecaster out of a coffee table ... tell me he doesn't have the know-how and is not happy with his free time. That's very admirable, IMO. I plan to be like that, working in some sort of electronic field with a wonderful side job.

Only one problem ... as odd as it sounds, my worst fear is the circuitboard. No idea why, never had a bad experience, but I suppose I'll just have to overcome it. I have a modem that doesn't work, maybe I'll get the guts to touch it and take it apart.

Thanks for all the posts, keep' em comin', tell me what you do!

[Brendo613]

Just thought I'd bump this back to the beginning so Fender, SocialParasite, Tyler and BluesMetal can tell me what you guys do for work. I am looking into colleges and different schools now, like DeVry and whatnot. I'd love to get into the electronics field ... lots of money to be made there, so I see.

-Brendan http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/movingeyes.gif

[TylerDurden]

hey brendo, i saw your other post on the top and i swear to you, i didn't mean to sound like an a'hole.

when i said that stuff about parents bedrooms and stuff, i was just reflecting on what me and my friends used to do when we were, you know, not sober...

well, anyway, i'm a Computer Science and Electrical Eng major at Univ at Buffalo and I work as a public site consultant part-time at my school...
i'm really glad that you are considering giving a college a chance...good luck buddy.

[This message has been edited by TylerDurden (edited August 04, 2004).]

[Marcus Pryce]

Except for the tiny detail of driving a motorcycle, I agree to every aspect of the way you thought out life, down to the dark-haired chick in the cabin!
And in response to all this S.H.I.T. about college yadda, yadda, you'll end up flipping burgers until you die from it, yadda yadda
check this out (that goes for the rest of you too!)

Jimmy Page: The good thing about the guitar, was that they didn't teach it in school. Teaching myself was the first and most important part of my education. I know that Jeff Beck and I enjoyed pure music because we didn't have to.

From a man who is musically and financially successful and popularly accepted and discussed, even now at age 60.
I can't say that about many college graduates, especially all the ones who are trying to send me to college too, like my parents or my ****kicking headmaster.

There are other people like you Brendan. We just have to find one who makes a lot of money and introduce him to our parents, so they will stop being irritating.

[Brendo613]

Tyler, no problem, I was in a bit of an emotional state when I attacked the first few posts ... sorry about that.

Anyway, great posts, guys. I love hearing what you do, and Marcus, made me laugh at the end there, about introducing that famous musician to our parents http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/biggrin.gif Also a great quote there by Jimmy, never heard that one before. I suppose I'll seek out a steady career in electronics, and then become world-famous http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/stylin.gif

[Marcus Pryce]

Always glad to lighten up a situation. Who knows, maybe I'll make a smashing appearance at the Monterey Pop Festival 2007 (forty years after you-know-who was there) and set fire to my highschool diploma on stage.
But now, the truly vital question hanging over us is:
How do you wire two pick-ups to only one volume control with no selector switch?

[socialparasite]

Brendo613,

Hey I attend Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University better known as Virginia Tech. I am BIT major (Business Information Technology) also with a major in education. I have learned a whole lot hear the classes are not cake for me but I put in a lot of effort. The football games are great (I watched Michael Vick before he was a pro). There are a few places to gig at downtown and there is a great guitar instructor by the name of Richard Jesse. This school is very good for vets, computer science, engineer, and other fields. My job does not pay a whole lot but i am a full time student and get to do homework while working which is great. Good luck with your choices of school you should look in to coming here since you are interested in the electronics field. www.vt.edu (http://www.vt.edu)

[Ukalali_Solo]

hey marcus, heres a list of pickup scematics http://seymourduncan.com/website/support/schematics/

look for the specific thing here, i couldnt find just 2hum 1 vol and thats it.
oh and thanks for Fender65 for the link

phil

[Brendo613]

Still wondering what everyone's jobs are ... where are you guys?!
http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/dead.gif http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/eek2.gif http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/megafrown.gif

http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/movingeyes.gif

[Marcus Pryce]

Define "where". I'm probably thousands of miles from where you are, if that's what you mean.
As far as a job goes, I'm a full time loser.


[This message has been edited by Marcus Pryce (edited August 07, 2004).]

[Brendo613]

Naw, by "where" I meant where are you that you're not answering my posts http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/lol.gif

[supercobra]

Brendo,

Before you decide that money dosen't matter, I would recommend considering a couple things:

1) The average household income in the US is about $40,000. At this income, most families carry a lot of debt, and have very little disposable income.
2) If you want to have kids, making the average income will put you in an almost impossible bind. In this situation, you won't be able to afford to go to concerts, sporting events, have a nice vehicle, house, etc.

All this is OK if you're sure you don't want to have kids, but if you do, you had better think about a career.

In life, everything costs money. If you like nice things, like vacations, vehicles, a home, going out to eat, etc, I recommend raising your expectations.

10th grade is awefully young to start closing off options like school and career.

[Brendo613]

As you see, I have decided to keep my mind open. Thank you for the input, I can't believe the average is $40,000 ... doesn't sound like much.

I am looking into becoming some sort of electronics technician, I know many who are musical, have side hobbies, and great lives.

-Brendan http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/cool.gif

By the way, great to see you back on the forums again, Supercobra http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/color.gif

[This message has been edited by Brendo613 (edited August 09, 2004).]

[supercobra]

Brendan,

I'm not saying that we should lead colorless lives dedicated to the pursuit of money. In my case, I work very hard in technical sales (about 70 hrs/wk). My family takes up most of the balance of my time. But I make time to play, to create a little bit of artistry. I'm trying to get a band together to play covers again, even though I have little time for it.

I make about double the average, and still don't have funds to buy whatever guitar and amp I want. But I have variety in my life, and music is a big part of that. Limitations on time, money and energy force me to make difficult choices- but I strive to maintain that artistic side of life.

What I'm saying is, balance is good. Its awesome that you have some avocations that you care about. And, obviously you are balancing them with school. Remember to keep that balance, and you'll have the ability to do a lot of cool things.

[Brendo613]

Awesome. Great pointers there, I'll be sure to value them.

-Brendan

[Axe Victim]

If your serious about building guitars, you'll still need to learn how. If you have any desire to come to Ontario, Canada, check out lado-guitars.com they offer several different length lutherie courses.
These guys make primo guitars. I'm sure they teach well also.

[Brendo613]

Awesome, maybe when I can drive I'll take a road trip up there. Me 'rents love Canada, maybe we'll all go up there sometime ... is it expensive? I would think so ...

-Brendan

[dacster]

Building guitars would be cool. Perhaps start with a kit. Martin sells almost all of their giutars as kits with everyting done but final assembly. Or one of the Samic Electric kits. Or order parts from warmoth and build from scratch.
Only a few of the top builders really make a lot of money at it but there are a lot of folks who get by (make a decent living) making guitars. The tooling and hardware requirements are pretty similar to a high end furniture business. And some good business sense would help.
Look up a web site called the "13th fret" it is a place where acoustic guitar builders hang out to chat.
College will only help someone who has some brains and some common sense. I am and old electronics technician and I help 4/6/8 year degree'd engineers find wall plugs to plug in O scope's all the time. I also have to point out the difference between a phillips and a torx drive because half of them don't have any common sense.
One of the bigest things to remember is a college education is nothing more than a tool and If you cannot use the tool it is of no use. I guess some of these guys can write code pretty good but they can't seem to get the right shoe on the right foot if that makes sense.
I am 50 years old. High School Drop out. 10 years as a US Navy Electronics Technician now with Intel corporation repairing robotics and automated test equipment.
I am back in college however studying music..... hope I can show a bit of that common sense..........
Think hard about where you want to go. You have a long road in front of you. and no real hurry yet. Get into a local college and take some classes. Get a guitar kit and build it. You might really like it. If you do take some business classes. Or get into a luthiers school and learn from a master.
You can't always follow your dreams but you can let them help you find your way

[Brendo613]

Dacster, awesome post, makes me happy that people are so willing to offer their adivce to me. Fantastic quote at the end, too.

I will be sure to keep your words with me.

-Brendan

[metalguy]

Hello all,

Thats a cool idea to open your own shop but around where i live guitar center rules the roost so to speak, they have pretty much killed the mom and pop music shops around my area.

But i do guitar repair in my spare time although i must admit i get alot of work from GC by the way of them refering me to thier customers but its not my full time job. I do it to help relax and have fun.

[metalguy]

oh my real job http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/smile.gif is a software designer / applications developer

[Brendo613]

Yeah, it's a shame how all the little stores are being run out of business http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/rolleyes.gif Oreland Hardware, all the little stores ... makes me sad.

Thanks for the reply, though http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/color.gif glad to see people are still interested in answering this topic.

-Brendan http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/cool.gif

[BluesMetal]

I am a computer programmer working here for a local company writing code. Although lately I've been spending alot of time in a friend of mine's machine shop playing with his CNC machines, not computer programming but its fun hehe.

[Brendo613]

Awesome. Sure could spend a lot of time with CNC, I'd imagine ... http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/rotatesmilie.gif

-Brendan http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/cool.gif

[Axe Victim]

Not all small operations are being killed off.
I know in Toronto there are a couple of shops selling to some big names. Linda Manzer and Grit Laskin make guitars for some pretty big names. That's the market to go for. Not the $139 pieces of crap but the $4000 + custom made, works of art.
I can guarantee that Pat Metheny, Al Demiola, Paco De Lucia, etc, don't shop at G.C.

[Brendo613]

Axe Vicitim, good point, there.

[Shibby]

hey brendo, even if you can't make it as a guitar builder you can always marry someone rich. http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/movingeyes.gif

[Ukalali_Solo]

Well as much as id rather go to a little store and support them, rather than multibillion dollar GC, the reality is that GC just has a better variety, and they do cut on prices if you really kno how to work the salesman.

I have a local shop that sells all washburn guitars, they cant afford to pay fender and gibson 10,000 dollars just to become partners to just sell their guitars, but i go there for all my repair and lessons.

phil

[Brendo613]

I have been thinking for a while about an education in the electronics field. I'd like to learn all about circuitboards, capacitors, resisters, etc. Hopefully I will be able to build my own custom tube amps and sell them on the side, and perform mods on pedals, etc.

What kind of jobs could I get working with electronics, though? Jimmy, I know you work on amps, and I would love that, but I also don't think I'd be content living in an apt http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/think.gif.

Being a luthier and a custom amp builder would be great, but I'd still need a real job, I think, seeing how the world is today ... what else could I do?

I really want to live comfortably, and it looks like it'll be difficult.

=Brendan= http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/unsure.gif

[dkitt]

Hey Brendo, you might find this site interesting. Its run by a guy up here in Canada who has made a successful living as an independant luthier, making nothing but electrics.

In spite of the fact that his guitars are uglier than sin, he still manages to pull it off with humour and panache! I've learned alot about guitar building just from reading his articles.

WHOOPS! You move pretty fast Brendo! http://zacharyguitars.com

[This message has been edited by dkitt (edited September 04, 2004).]

[This message has been edited by dkitt (edited September 04, 2004).]

[Brendo613]

You are completely right, I would find that interesting, if only I could click on the link http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/tongue.gif

Long live cynicism http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/metalhead.gif.

I am interested in seeing his site, though, please do post that link.

=Brendan= http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/color.gif

[dkitt]

I don't get enough breathing space on this forum - go back a page Brendo. Its there now!

[Brendo613]

http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/lol.gif You're right, odd guitars ... some of them look interesting, but do they all have the 15th pen headstock? Bleh.

Interesting that he makes his living off of those things! http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/eek3.gif

=Brendan= http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/cool.gif

[dkitt]

Bleh! That's what I said! Pin-head stocks!

It shows you what a guy can do with a lot of hard work, knowledge, the best materials/electronics and a little showmanship though doesn't it...and we all know you've got plenty of that!

[Brendo613]

http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/biggrin.gif Thank you much, I believe I do have that.

It's 2:07 a.m. right now, and I just got back from a wonderful drum circle and jam with friends.

Time the hell for bed! http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/stern.gif

=Brendan= http://www.zentao.com/ubb/smilies/tongue.gif

[100%TEXAN]

.

There are other people like you Brendan. We just have to find one who makes a lot of money and introduce him to our parents, so they will stop being irritating.

I *HATED* High School and only wnet to college so my parents would keep supplying me with beer (and back then drug) money. Well, they didn't resally know that's what I was spending it on. Probably *suspected* it tho . . .

Anyway, I dropped outta college as well.

My other big love is computers and I'me a self taught network guru of sorts. When I bother to work I generally pull down 80-100K a year plus good bennies.

No one ever asked me about a degree or what my GPA was. Of course, I spent years building a rep as an independent consultant (about 10) and very nearly starved to death a few times - but thumbing my nose at the accepted social structure was worth it . . . for the most part.

Money only buys so much happiness (for me at least) and then you start regretting being stuck in cubicle land (refer to the movie 'Office Space' for a good parallel to my life in the IT industry).

On the other hand, if it hadn't been for a forgiving, if not understanding, family - I would have been living in a box on the side fo the road during some of those lean times I refered to.

Also, I have sold and/or pawned (and lost) my best computers, guns, and guitar gear more times than I can count over the years just to survive at times because of the choices I made when I was your age.

Ideals are all good and well, but they don't put food on the table and a roof over your head and one by one your friends eventually get married and you slowly run out of couches to flop on . . .

College is not a necesissity by any means, but there are days I wish I had a degree so that I had more options (I'm sorta pidgeon holed with my skills and w/o some sort of degree I have to rely on my prior experience to get the *good* jobs).

All that being said, I just got rid of a gig that paid 80K a year and sent me all over the planet on their dime so I could stay in Austin and focus on music more.

Probably a stupid thing to do since I'm 10K in the hole and engaged to be married in six months, so I guess I'll have to find another @$#%^^%# real job soon . . .

If you love music so much you could always go to college to study that. I'm quite sure that you will be more likely to find like minded students in the music department than in the engineering department.

Also, no offense, but your vision of college seems a bit . . . well . . . like what one would expect from a 15 year old - and hey, I was sure I had all the answers back when I was 15 too. I got a motorcycle when I was 16, split home, found and 'abandoned' house on the south side of town, turned the power and water back on myself, and squatted there for quite sometime while working as a cook in a restaraunt. Of course, back then an apartment (when I finally got one - the houses owner eventually found out I had moved in) was $250 a month, gas was like 50-60 cents a gallon (if that), and food and booze was free since in worked in a restaraunt/bar.

Anyway, my point is that college doesn't have to be like that. My problem with college was I was flopping around and didn't know what I wanted to study. I *should* have gone for a degree in music . . .well, actually my problem in college was too much beer, too much cocaine, and too many hallucnigins . . . so I ended up dropping out. I have always been amazed that I was lucky enough to have developed a skill, outside of school, that would make me a decent living . . . but I consider myself to be *lucky* in that aspect. All of my other friends that had the same attitude that I (and that you seem to) have ended up working crap jobs and always being in the hole with no way to get out. Most are pretty miserable now.

I hate to paint a dark picture, and I hate to preach since I 'took the path less travelled', but school is important to have to fall back on. Again, a degree is not as important as it used to be, but then again it opens way more doors than no degree does and, in hard times (like now when good jobs are scarce) it's better to have on than not to have one.

I'm actually considering going back to school at this point so I'll have more options. Still, I have realized that music was my first love and I should have stuck with that somehow.

One option you might want to consider is something like the Conservatory of Arts and Recording in Tempe Arizona. You could go there and learn sound engineering. They place like 90% of their grads in jobs immediatly after graduation. I looked into this myself recently.

Also, some places , like South West Texas Univeristy have AWSOME, recording studios and music degree programs.

Oh yea, another thing about college is that, if you pick the right one, they have AWSOME music scenes and you can hook up with a lot of good players that way. UT in Austin TX, Southwest in San Marcos TX, and UofA Tucson in AZ all come to mind.

Again, I don't wanna sound like I'm comming down on you, but take it from someone who has been there, done that, and gotten the bloody t-shirt (and rap sheet) to show for it - what looks like a great idea when you are a teenager can look a *WHOLE* lot different when you're looking at your 40th birthday looming just down the road a bit.

Life, for most folks (ie those of us who are not from wealthy families) is a series of compromises. We do something we *****ng *HATE* so we can afford to stay alive and do what we love.

The lucky ones are the ones that get rich or manage to find a way making a living doing what they love - but they make up a *small* percentage of the population.

Also, when you get older, if you get sick, the doctors bills ain't cheap. I got sick recently (GI issues Acid reflux and complications) because of the stress related to my job (one of the reasons I'm not working at the moment) and even *with* good insurance I've got 1000's of $'s in doctors bills . . . just something to think about.

Another side of the coin is that you don't have to become famous and have gold records to make a 'comfortable' living at music. You just need to work it - also a *very* understanding wife with a real job (for a steady income to pay the bills and a medical policy) does not hurt. I've got a few friends and acquaintances that make a living in the biz and are no more than regionaly well known.

Sorry if this sounds like a mixed message. It's just that I by no means wanyt to disuade you from your dreams and aspirations. I just want to give you a dose of the realities of the real world (as I've encountered a *LOT* of them) to help you better adjust your long term plan so you don't end up locked in a box you can never get out of.

All that being said I, of course, wish you all the luck in any endevors you decide to undertake :-)

On second thaught, maybe I'm *not* the one to introduce to ya'lls parents :-)

[Brendo613]

I enjoyed that post very much, Texan. It's always good to hear from people who have taken that road.

I really admire your wisdom and the advice you have given me, as I would like to have a career that can hold me up well with my hobbies ... perhaps I can take a course to learn about electronics (capacitors and resistors and whatnot) and then build some amps on my own, mostly for fun (but completely for sound!).

I know two friends of my dad and mine, Tom and Butch. Butch retired not too long ago, but Tom still works for Athena. They both have great amps and guitars, and, while Tom lives like a slob (so I hear), he has fantastic equipment. Butch has a cute little house in a borough between two crowded towns, and six acres of land. We recently just had a crumcircle in his yard, which was nothing short of fantastic. Very relaxing ... it later turned into an acoustic guitar jam, as usual :D

The point is that these are two people I know who, with a little education, are very happy with their lives. While neither are rolling in cash, they are comfortably living. However, I don't know how easy that will be with the changing times as they are ...

What could college offer me as opposed to a tech school? In a tech school I could learn all about electronics, perhaps become some sort of electronics technician. I would really enjoy that.

But then there's reality, kicking my ash :rolleyes:.

=Brendan=

[100%TEXAN]

Did he buy the land? Or inherit it? A lot of folks I always assumed did ok w/o real jobs or an education, when I was young, I found out when I got older that they had got their land from relatives - as well as most fo their savings :-)

Or it could be that one of them invested wisely and/or saved (I never did either one) and the other didn't and so is still working.

Anyway, glad my point oh two cents made sense to you. If nothing else perhaps my life can serve as a warning to others <grin>

As far as college versus a tek school? You would probably learn waht you need in a tek school. It's just, like I said, easier to get a job in lean times with a real degree. Given two candidates, one with a degree and one without, *most* managers hire the guy withe the degree. Personally I'd take the guy with more hands on experience - and there are folks out there who do that but just not as many who will hire someone with a degree. Sux . . . but it is what it is.

Also college, if you pick one in a town with a good music scene, will give you four years of jamming with like minded musicians in an enviroment that is typically quite inducive of creativity.

Also, the real world sucks and college is a good way to avoid it for another four years :D .

[Marcus Pryce]

Someone quoted me, this is scary...

[100%TEXAN]

. . . .




:eek: BOO! :eek:



. . .


:bounce1:

[Brendo613]

Hehehe, naw, my friend bought his land. He's had many different houses, and he affords it all with no health insurance and staying safe. It doesn't sound stupid to me, I have no intententions of getting hoit, either.

Everyone, don't even start :biggrin1:

=Brendan= :unsure1: