'Set Up' vid finally here....

[genereaux]

Sorry that took so long.

Here ya go;


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If anyone needs further clarification, just ask.......


sean

[Fendershredder]

genereaux thanks for this vid! I have a question...where can I get the tool you use to lower your saddles? I've always had trouble dealing with those god damn posts...

[BKent]

Appreciate the vid, Gens! Very helpful. I feel confident I could handle that.

I thought the element of intonation was affected by this also (like roll, pitch, and yaw). THAT is what I'd be concerned about the most, personally.

I fully grasp the height and adjusting the neck bow, how often is the intonation is affected? In my case with the Strat, would I need any string length adjustment from the screws on the end of the saddles? Or, are those adjustments you made so minimal, ultimately, that it's not a concern?

Again, I appreciate the vid, I learned twice as much as I knew before!

[genereaux]

genereaux thanks for this vid! I have a question...where can I get the tool you use to lower your saddles? I've always had trouble dealing with those god damn posts...
mmmmmmmmm, an allen wrench?
That's all it is, it's just a little set/kit or 9 different sizes. Kinda like a Swiss Army knife, only all hex keys.


I thought the element of intonation was affected by this also (like roll, pitch, and yaw). THAT is what I'd be concerned about the most, personally.

Intonation is probably the next video, and it's own procedure. I was careful to word this a "BASIC Setup", because I know some shops/techs would say it should be part of any set up.
I say 'one step at a time, people'. First, you string the dang thing up (Vid 1), the do a 'set-up' (Vid 2) THEN we address the intonation (again, probly Vid 3)



I fully grasp the height and adjusting the neck bow, how often is the intonation is affected? In my case with the Strat, would I need any string length adjustment from the screws on the end of the saddles? Or, are those adjustments you made so minimal, ultimately, that it's not a concern?


It depends, but I would say 'yes, expect to look at the intonation'. In the case of that green guitar I used in the video, when I assembled and strung it, I think I did a ballpark intonation at best.
But, after I did the set-up, I checked it out, and it was dead on.

In short, all those things CAN affect intonation (which is why I say do it last), but they don't always.......




sean

[ANGRY PYGMY]

Great vid. Coo, to see it in action.
Got a question, though.
What is the next logical step if you cant get the action you want without buzz?
Fret work?...neck shimming? If shimming is the answer...which way(front of pocket/back of neck pocket, etc.)
I know the answers to that are probably pretty complex...just curious what your thoughts are on "problem child" guitars

[scott powell]

that was a GREAT vid! i have played for a very long time ,but realized i still had things to learn. thanx for such an informative vid

[SteveNbr]

thanks Sean.

With this vid, I'm pretty sure I could screw up with confidence!!

my former teacher did a quick little (re-)setup on my strat one day...

I'd like to spend a little more time than he did with it.

My neck is slightly bowed (twisted might be the more correct description), and he tried to compensate for it... said he did, and that it was a great player now... I'm not sold, but I can't really tell. (he sells guitars, so no real reason to lie to me, other than keep my confidence high)

thanks again... your quite the stagemaster.

(then again, tell your lighting guy to step it up a lil)

[Plain G]

Thanks Sean, really like this kind of vid. Your road case is very cool. Chuckled about the beach git giving it's body for science :)
I've done a few set ups including intonation and the thing that surprised me on the first couple was how long it can take. It's something that can't be rushed but is a ton of fun at the same time.

How do you feel about better tone with more string to pup distance? Is there a favourite distance and can you reconcile less volume with better tone?

[genereaux]

What is the next logical step if you cant get the action you want without buzz?
It's situational. If you have the saddles raised pretty high, or really low, that's when I'd start shimming. Usually at heel of the neck pocket.

Errant frets most likely cause problems to a single (or couple) strings(s) and not across ALL the strings. So, during a set up, I would expect a fret issue to present as one or two saddles seeming notable higher than the others (and not following any apparent radius).
In which case, find then inspect the fret. If it's a new, or even just 'young' guitar, a filing or fret dress most likely isn't needed. More often, the fret has just come partially un-seated.


How do you feel about better tone with more string to pup distance? Is there a favourite distance and can you reconcile less volume with better tone?
It's entirely user preference. If you love the tone with the pickup set really low, then I might recommend a boost pedal or even just turning up the whole amp.

It's also a good way to keep a really hot pickup from completely blasting out a lesser output pickup in the same axe. Just set the hotter P/U much lower than the other til the difference in output level seems less drastic.


My neck is slightly bowed (twisted might be the more correct description), and he tried to compensate for it... said he did, and that it was a great player now... I'm not sold, but I can't really tell. (he sells guitars, so no real reason to lie to me, other than keep my confidence high)
When I hear 'twisted, I think 'warped'. And that IS pretty bad. Usually I'd just swap the neck out. IF that's the case.
But I presume the axe is playable, which leads me to assume, if there IS a warp, it's not that severe.
Is the action for one half of the string (bass/treble) notably higher than the other?


(then again, tell your lighting guy to step it up a lil)
Yeah, I wanna fire the 'lighting guy'......

that was a GREAT vid! i have played for a very long time ,but realized i still had things to learn. thanx for such an informative vid

aww, thanks scott

[SteveNbr]

"When I hear 'twisted, I think 'warped'. And that IS pretty bad. Usually I'd just swap the neck out. IF that's the case.
But I presume the axe is playable, which leads me to assume, if there IS a warp, it's not that severe.
Is the action for one half of the string (bass/treble) notably higher than the other?"


Well, it's definately playable... b/c I play it almost everyday. (and sometimes I can fool myself into thinking I sound good.) But, ya know, I'm a newbie, and pretty much all my playing is between the nut and the 12th fret... but hope to change that soon.

Not sure I understand your question, but with all of my strings, the action is MUCH higher (at least twice) at the 21st fret vs. the 1st fret.

I hadn't even considered a new neck, but I sure like the thought. Pretty easy to change on a Strat, I'd guess. I guess you can buy them loaded with frets and nut, huh?... I'm not much in the mood for a full fledged project.

thanks for your help, Sean.

[Fendershredder]

mmmmmmmmm, an allen wrench?
That's all it is, it's just a little set/kit or 9 different sizes. Kinda like a Swiss Army knife, only all hex keys.


Is it really a hex? Those things are so small...I never really noticed. I have a set of allen keys, but it seems all of the ones I have are too big for the posts...oh well, I'll just have to go buy some :)

[McStuff]

That's a great video, I'll have to try that on both my guitars. And I have one question. Does string gauge have an affect on how high the action can be set? I would think lower gauge strings would flop more and require a higher action. Am I correct?

[genereaux]

Not sure I understand your question, but with all of my strings, the action is MUCH higher (at least twice) at the 21st fret vs. the 1st fret.

It SOUNDS like you might just be able to adjust the action and call it good. I'm not SURE your neck is warped per se (but hard to know w/o looking at it)
If you're not ready for the full deal, you can just try dropping the saddles down. If you can get a better height on the 6th string, go ahead and do all of 'em. If you can't get any better w/o doing the truss rod, hold off til you're ready for a 'project'

Is it really a hex? Those things are so small...I never really noticed. I have a set of allen keys, but it seems all of the ones I have are too big for the posts...oh well, I'll just have to go buy some :)
Yup. Just REALLY small allens. You can find 'em about everywhere...

Does string gauge have an affect on how high the action can be set? I would think lower gauge strings would flop more and require a higher action. Am I correct?
Yeah, but it depends on scale length too, as far as HOW floppy they may be....

[McStuff]

Yeah, but it depends on scale length too, as far as HOW floppy they may be....

One of mine is 24.75", which is a les paul copy from rondo. My other is an affinity strat, which has a 25.5" scale length. I like the ability to bend better on the 9's (which the strat currently has), but I want a lower action. So I was wondering if 9's vs 10's would have a big effect on the strat's lowest action without buzz.

[SteveNbr]

It SOUNDS like you might just be able to adjust the action and call it good. I'm not SURE your neck is warped per se (but hard to know w/o looking at it)
If you're not ready for the full deal, you can just try dropping the saddles down. If you can get a better height on the 6th string, go ahead and do all of 'em. If you can't get any better w/o doing the truss rod, hold off til you're ready for a 'project'


Yea, I can see that its warped. And I do think my ex-teacher did a pretty good job of adjusting the truss rod, and the saddles to try to compensate for it...

all the same, you did get me thinking about a new neck. I had already decided to one day soon, buy an axe with a maple fretboard, so why not buy a neck and get the maple and unwarped neck, all in one? I do have a backup axe to get me through a few days of unassembled Strat, if needed.

I shopped around a little online. Are the MightyMite necks pretty good? The one I was looking at has 22 frets instead of the 21 mine has, but has the same scale, and same nut width as mine. I also saw the Warmoths, for more money.

If this is much of a discussion, I'll be glad to start a new thread.

Thanks again for your help.

[HalfBlindLefty]

Thanks, great vid.
For me it's a reminder of.... how did I do that...waaaaaay back :)
Just changed the strings on my Greg Bennett Avion from .09 to .10 and it needs a tiny adjustment for the neck bow (Have to lessen it)
So this evening the Avion will be on the surgery table :D

[Tingly]

'Great job!!

I know: I inspired you. :)

Yes.

Don't deny it, because I have you saying it on tape, g-man...

[Sonofarich]

Cool video...good insight.

Another thing I tend to check/adjust for a setup would be the nut slot height, if necessary. I'm amazed sometimes how bad they can be from the factory for some. Capo/depress between the 2nd/3rd fret and check height off the first fret (~.005). I also take a quick truss rod check by eliminating the nut with a capo at the first fret and check string height at the 8th fret. Sometimes gives a good reference point to start, just to get an idea of what is going on...before diving in.

So what video is next?

[genereaux]

One of mine is 24.75", which is a les paul copy from rondo. My other is an affinity strat, which has a 25.5" scale length. I like the ability to bend better on the 9's (which the strat currently has), but I want a lower action. So I was wondering if 9's vs 10's would have a big effect on the strat's lowest action without buzz.
Well, I'd say jump in a try it. I run 8s and 9s on some axes, and some of them still roll with a pretty low action. I guess you'll need to try it to see if it works for you/your ax....

'Great job!!

I know: I inspired you. :)

Yes.

Don't deny it, because I have you saying it on tape, g-man...
Daaaah! Caught me..........

Cool video...good insight.

Another thing I tend to check/adjust for a setup would be the nut slot height, if necessary.

So what video is next?
True enough, but I'm trying to hold SOME focus for these videos so I can actually pass something to the viewer. If I were a superhero, I'd be Cpt. Tangent- It's all I can do to keep these under 10 minutes ( I'm kinda surprised they get watched, being over THREE minutes)
I figure I would touch on the nut/nut slots in a future vid.

Next one up will probly be 'Intonation'


sean

[McStuff]

Well, I'd say jump in a try it. I run 8s and 9s on some axes, and some of them still roll with a pretty low action. I guess you'll need to try it to see if it works for you/your ax....


sean

Dang, 8's? Well now I know what I'll be doing this weekend. Although I'm convinced my agile has a bad 3rd fret, but I'm gonna pick up a new set of strings and some fretboard conditioner because it needs both. I might as well pick up another set for the strat because it's had these strings on for a while, and I want to paint the pickguard etc.

[fused]

Excellent! Awesome Job!

I would like your thoughts on setting the tone bar on a Paul...

And do you ever do the full setup, cut slots on a Gibby Nut or Bridge saddles etc...???

Fret leveling....etc.... Seems that you're doing a basic setup....

Thanks man... Again, great job :)

fused

[ScottRiley]

Sean that was awesome!!

Really cool of you to make and it was a pleasure to watch, you're a funny guy even when you're touching on something scientific and procedural :D

I learned a lot and look forward to trying the stuff you mention out!!

Brilliant addition to the video section!

[ANGRY PYGMY]

Generaux, dont be so suprised people watch your vids. Theyre GREAT. Im on dial up, that one took about two hours to download....worth every second, imo.

[schneefux]

thank you sooooo much generaux!!! I can´t tell you how much this helped me. your work´s greatly appreciated!

i felt sorry for that 10$ guitar ^^

[CyberCobre]

PHENOMENAL! I couldn't get it to come up, but, finally, I must have done something right, because I FINALLY got to see this. Genereaux, AWESOME!!!

[Hitman!]

I just used your vid to help me set-up the action on my Tele. It's not great as my usual tech would've done it, but close, very close. Thanks for posting this vid buddy!

[McStuff]

When you use the dime for measuring, what fret are you using for reference?

[genereaux]

When you use the dime for measuring, what fret are you using for reference?

12th. In the video anyway. As I said, I stumbled across that little tidbit, so it's not a technique I've used all THAT much. I mostly set by feel/eye.
Though, in my experience, the 12th fret is good reference fret; in that that's essentially where the neck 'bends' when the truss rod is adjusted.
But remember, the ideal is a uniform height (as uniform as you can get a given neck anyway) off the frets. So, in a perfect world- once you've dialed in the 12th fret, the others should all be pretty much 'dime high' as well.


sean

[hammer]

Thanks for the vid genereaux, first rate! I have too admit, I usually try to guess how the truss rod is going to settle... because I'm impatient. You did it right.

Thanks again it must have taken a bit of time to complete.