when and how to get your 1st gig

[hardstarter]

My band is starting to write some of our own stuff and i was wondering when we should start looking for gigs(how many songs we need etc.) And how to present ourselves to the club owner. ty.

[Keith]

Well, first and foremost, you need a demo tape of the band.3 songs will do.It doesn't need to be of studio quality, but it helps.For most openers, you will need at least 45 minutes of material, either covers or original.
You present your material ONLY to the bar owner/manager.No one else.
explain what style you play and ask if there is an open slot.You may end up playing a Monday night or Sunday afternoon so that the club can assess your qualites.
Also, get a pic of the band all together.You don't need your gear involved, and you don't need the whole band to be there when you try and cut a deal.
Be very wary when dealing gigs.There is a good chance that you might get screwed over for $.
I had an experience with a club manager at RPM's.
The deal was for $600 for headlining.
We did our show, got a great crowd for the 11:00PM slot, and then the manager said that he only said he would pay us $300.
Little did he know that when I made the deal, I had a micro cassette recorder in my pocket recording everything.When I said that he lied to me, he said to prove it.At that point, I pulled out the tape and played it back to him with the owner right there.Needless to say that we got our $, and the manager was fired on the spot after I had said that I was going to jump on stage and play the tape through the house P.A. if we were not paid the $ promised.
* Get posters made up so when you get a gig, you can post them with the venue and time*

[Brendo613]

Whoa, that's a killer close call, Keith :eek2:. Great thinking with the tape recorder, too! Hope you don't mind if I steal that ideer :wink:

=Brendan= :shifty:

[Keith]

Go right ahead Brendo.. all the more power to the people that get the job done I always say.

[t_shirtsnjeans]

You could ask the club manager to come hear your band jam at another location.
Or ask for referals from others who have listened to you.
Perhaps if you have your stuff on a site where they can go online and listen?
Really, you shouldn't expect to get paid for your first gig unless you do have exposure and reputation to follow you.
Let 'em test drive you for an hour or so at their convenience and then let them decide.
I'd also say put things in writing about agreements on payment, have witnesses sign along with the owner/manager. Perhaps pull someone in that's not partial to either party to sign. But get it in writing. Recordings sometimes can't be used as proof.
But promo kits are good, as long as your kits don't end up in the trash as soon as you leave!
Expect a lot of 'no's' to every yes you get though and keep hammerin' away! You'll do well, I'm sure.

[supercobra]

Keith is right- getting screwed is a major hazard. The band I'm in has a standard contract which specifies things like- how much we get paid, how long we play, the fact that we control the volume, that if we're asked to stop we still get paid, band gets free soft drinks, how long breaks last, etc.

You won't get every club to agree to every item, but you at least have the option of crossing the item off if you're willing to bend.

Having a signed contract is a must. For us, we won't show up without a prior signed contract.

This leads to another subject. How many of you guys have run into club owners who try to book bands into their ****** dives, and hold the band entirely accountable for the crowd? I've dealt with this, and my opinion is that its a two way street- On one hand the band must be able to hold the crowd, but can't be expected to draw a significant crowd to a bar that dosent already have a clintele accustomed to comming to see live music. A few yeas ago I had a club owner try to reduce our wage because the crowd was small. In playing there more than once, I could tell that there weren't many regulars. The club owner made the argument that, 'why should I pay for entertainment that dosen't fill my club?'.

[wazman]

Keith is right- getting screwed is a major hazard. The band I'm in has a standard contract which specifies things like- how much we get paid, how long we play, the fact that we control the volume, that if we're asked to stop we still get paid, band gets free soft drinks, how long breaks last, etc.

You won't get every club to agree to every item, but you at least have the option of crossing the item off if you're willing to bend.

Having a signed contract is a must. For us, we won't show up without a prior signed contract.

This leads to another subject. How many of you guys have run into club owners who try to book bands into their ****** dives, and hold the band entirely accountable for the crowd? I've dealt with this, and my opinion is that its a two way street- On one hand the band must be able to hold the crowd, but can't be expected to draw a significant crowd to a bar that dosent already have a clintele accustomed to comming to see live music. A few yeas ago I had a club owner try to reduce our wage because the crowd was small. In playing there more than once, I could tell that there weren't many regulars. The club owner made the argument that, 'why should I pay for entertainment that dosen't fill my club?'.

Having contracts used to be the way it was... When I was in the musician's union, the band I was in had a contract before we even showed up. Sadly, it seems not to be the case any longer.

And it did help. My dad told me once about a time he and a friend played a place way back in college, and the guy never paid them. So they went to the musician's union, and the union blacklisted the guy - all the other unions (truck drivers and such) supported them. They finally got their money years later, but it was something to see all those people pull together.

Nowadays, it's pretty much a "Too bad, so sad" attitude.

[MattB]

...of course, before you do any of the stuff mentioned above, you gotta make sure that you're REALLY ready to play!! You should plan on practicing for at least a few months before you even think about hunting around for a gig. The first band that I was in (back in high school) made that mistake. We landed our first gig at our local college (there was a pretty solid punk/indie scene there at the time). It was on a weekend, and the place where we were to play was hoppin' with kids of all ages, eager to see some good music. Well, we thought that we were ready to play. Our set was horrible!! I remeber people laughing (and even heckling) us during the performance. But, we (the band) stood firm and at least finished the set. There was some good that came about from the experience, however. Sucking so bad at that first gig really made me realize how important practice is. I wanted to make sure that the next gig we'd play would be awesome, so we all practiced 110% more. Thankfully, we went on to become a respected and highly recognized band throughout the area. Sure, we had some bad shows as well as really good shows, but the bad shows were usually on account of the sound guy not knowing what the hell he was doing.
Just make sure that you practice, practice, practice!!!!

[Keith]

You could ask the club manager to come hear your band jam at another location.
Or ask for referals from others who have listened to you.
Perhaps if you have your stuff on a site where they can go online and listen?I will guarantee that no club manager will come and see you play, unless you have a decent following.And as far as a site goes, they don't have the time to bother unless you have a good standing name and they know ahead of time that your band can bring in the crowd.
Really, you shouldn't expect to get paid for your first gig unless you do have exposure and reputation to follow you.
True to a certain extent.If the club manager/owner has heard a demo, he will decide whether it's worth even having you onstage.Play the demo infront of him.
my first gig at the age of 15, we got paid $75 for the whole band.not much,but it was something.But you should expect something out of it.

[supercobra]

Hey MattB
I hear your point about getting ready. Just don't forget that you're talking about a lot of work. We guitar players tend to develop such a strong ethic about preparing that we forget that, when we perform at a club, we are providing a valuable service. If you do the work, if you play a quality show, you deserve to be paid decently.

I think that we guitarrists really screw each other over becuase so many of us show up to play with stars in our eyes, ready to play for nothing (or next to it). Do you think the bar owner apologizes for the price of beer? Hell no. So why should we be sheepish about demanding reasonable compensation?

You young guys on this site, chatting about whether you're ready to play, and how to get a gig and such, need to keep something in mind. Once you step into that club, you're a pro. The club owner is making money on you, the patrons are drinking, and you're doing your job.

And about unions, I would like to see stronger support for union membership. Lets stop giving it away, people.

[gtrhrcane]

And about unions, I would like to see stronger support for union membership. Lets stop giving it away, people.

I'm curious, I haven't researched too much on the musicians unions, but couldn't we start our own? I mean really the majority of it is strength in numbers, politiking, and standing strong right?

Who here knows any of the business ends of a union? Let's start the Stone Dragon Union of Guitar and Bass Players...

[MattB]

Quote:
Hey MattB
I hear your point about getting ready. Just don't forget that you're talking about a lot of work. We guitar players tend to develop such a strong ethic about preparing that we forget that, when we perform at a club, we are providing a valuable service. If you do the work, if you play a quality show, you deserve to be paid decently.
You young guys on this site, chatting about whether you're ready to play, and how to get a gig and such, need to keep something in mind. Once you step into that club, you're a pro.

Don't get me wrong, Cobra, I totally agree with what's been discussed here as far as performers getting their fair share of money from bars. In my previous post, I wasn't trying to take away from that message or imply that bands shouldn't be concerned with what they're supposed to make for playing a show. I was merely trying to point out another important aspect of playing live. Everybody else seemed to be doing a well enough job talking about the band vs. the ****** club owner, so I thought I'd mention something else. Besides, I have yet to play a show at a bar (and I'm 26) so I don't really have anything to add to what you all have been talking about...

[MattB]

...oh yeah, just how do you "quote" someone properly in these forums??

[Slipstream]

...oh yeah, just how do you "quote" someone properly in these forums??
Stomp on the 'Quote' pedal on the right.

[MattB]

...that makes sense!!! Can't believe I didn't notice that before...

[Keith]

we learn in our own time..

[jaredc]

lol wow thanks

[supercobra]

I have yet to play a show at a bar (and I'm 26) so I don't really have anything to add to what you all have been talking about...

So what's slowing you up? I'm not picking on you, Matt, but it seems like we have a small ratio of guys who actually play out, compared to guys who are virtuosos when they're alone. I think gigging is where its at. For me, if I'm not playing out, I'm scheming to put something together. And I'm no chop champion. Its just that I think Rock & Roll was made for the stage.

If you're good enough to play alone and not bore yourself, I think you could get paid to play. So why not try?

[Ranger]

Yeah, isn't that hawt?

[SG_74]

I'm curious, I haven't researched too much on the musicians unions, but couldn't we start our own? I mean really the majority of it is strength in numbers, politiking, and standing strong right?

Who here knows any of the business ends of a union? Let's start the Stone Dragon Union of Guitar and Bass Players...


I'm in on that :p

C'mon ppl!

[Jeebas_13]

If you're good enough to play alone and not bore yourself, I think you could get paid to play. So why not try?

Yeah, i guess its just what you want out of it all though. For years ive tried to get technique and theory right.. simply for the enjoyment factor. I guess i am a typical bedroom guitarist. everything from modes over changes to sightreading, to speed, to slowness. and i feel ive gotten somewhere. But once i realised this, it was like, "well now what?" Because especially with chops, its like being muscularly fit. You can have all the strength in the world but unless you've got an activity or sport to use it with(like weightlifting), what's the point. Because shredding and strectching all take time to build, and it takes stuff all time to lose what you had in within days. Its like a rollercoaster. And for me it became pointless becuase no one could hear it, there was no song to accompany it, it was like i keep my muscles built up incase someone had an emergancy where i quickly had to step in and shred something. So i guess i changed because i felt i peaked. And now i can see that music really is on the stage. But the stuff i did has certinally helped with covers and stuff i do now.

[gtrhrcane]

I'm in on that :p

C'mon ppl!

Ok, well looking back, I see we have 2 people interested in getting this going. I'm going to research some of the business end of it, but I dn' see why we can't start our own union. We need stronger member ship than this though, certainly no offense to you SG74, or anyone for that matter.

COME ONE! I'm almost ready to start playing out, and with or without a band, open mic night, party or whatever, I'm going to just start going for it. eventually, powers that be willing, I can start making some money and I want to make sure I don't have to bring the less desirable side of business to the table if I don't have to, which I'm sure I will have to threaten at least once from the sounds of it. But it we could represent a strong membership that could rise out of the underground and fight back this pop culture bs with our own stations, communications, etc. etc.

It's time to bring the power back.

[SKEETER]

Where I live (central ohio) some club owners will indeed come and see the band I am in. There are some owners and managers out there that cruies other establishments just to see bands. Although that is not real common, it is not unheard of either. One place I am trying to get us into wants to come and see us first, and this weekend we had a group of people from another place come to see us, for the purpose of booking us.
One real important thing about getting gigs is being prepared to play music that is not exactly what you like the best. The band I am in does a wide range of music, and we do a lot of standard stuff to please them.
One thing to always keep in mind is that the club owners are not there to showcase your band, they are there to sell booze, and that means they want bands that will attract people that will buy booze. In other words, patrons of clubs could care less what your particular preference is in music, they want to hear what THEY want, not what you want to play. This means you gotta do a lot of bending.......

[PhantomLord]

I'm in on that :p

C'mon ppl!

i second that, i'm with you guys :D

fight the power!

[mik]

its all about being in the right place at the right time, we made a demo but the gig we got was because of contacts. just put yourself outthere find out near venues and ask them if theyre looking for new acts.

as far as songs goes, do more covers than originals, as the audience likes to sing along.

[Pick_Master]

yeh ur always hearing of bands that get discoeverd at a small gig
thats wat im waiting for........

[SKEETER]

One very important aspect of getting gigs is being willing to play what the bar owners want. Find out who is playing at the local places, and then look the bands up on the net and check out their set lists, that will give you an idea of what style of music to do, and what is going over good in your town. And, always remember, you are playing for the bar owners to sell booze, not so you can be the next big thing. Bars want bands that get people dancing and having a good time, and sticking around long enough to have a few beers. That is all they want from bands, the bottom line.